Ash Greninja [QC: 0/3]

Status
Not open for further replies.

Take Azelfie

More flags more fun
[OVERVIEW]

  • Extremely potent late game cleaner with the unique niche of keeping its 'boost' even after switching out
  • Powerful STABs that hit most of the tier at least neutrally
  • An insane speed tier that outspeed most Pokemon even before Battle Bond.
  • Is very frail and vulnerable to hazards
  • Sort of struggles prior to getting Battle Bond due to being outsped by Tapu Koko and having a lower damage output that fails to get some 2HKOes.
  • Some Pokemon can switch into Greninja with no fear such as Toxapex or Arghonaut.

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Dark Pulse
move 3: Water Shuriken
move 4: Spikes
item: Choice Specs
ability: Battle Bond
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
  • Hydro Pump is Greninja's hardest hitting STAB and is its safest bet on getting the KOs it needs.
  • Dark Pulse allows Greninja to hit targets that would normally resist Water such as Water and Dragon-types such as Rotom-W, Necturna, Latios
  • Water Shuriken gives Greninja some of the fastest priority moves in the whole metagame and allows pre-Battle Bond Greninja to revenge kill some faster threats such as Tapu Koko and Stratagem
  • Spikes allows Greninja to capitalize on the many switches it forces and can pave a way for itself in the future, but requires some prediction
Set Details
========

  • Choice Specs and maximum Special Attack investment allows Greninja to hit as hard as possible.
  • 252 Speed and a Timid nature allows Greninja to outspeed some crucial Pokemon like Tapu Koko after Battle Bond
  • Battle Bond itself transforms Greninja and gives it a boost to its most important stats after securing a KO.

Usage Tips
========

  • Unlike most sweepers, Greninja's 'set-up' is doesn't get reset after switching out so making sure Greninja can transform as early as possible puts you in the best position.
  • When hard counters are present like Arghonaut and Toxapex are present try to restrict your use of Greninja or use it as a lure to bring in something that threatens the predicted switch in.
  • Greninja is a very prediction heavy Pokemon in the early game so make sure to consider what move you use when Pokemon that can switch into Greninja's STABs are still present. This is especially true when Greninja has not transformed yet so try to use Spikes to weaken Greninja counters for later. Good prediction is key to getting Greninja's transformation. Spikes is usually used best in the early game to make sweeping with Hydro Pump easier in the late game.
  • Greninja despises any form of chip damage as its very fragile. Avoid taking unnecessary damage from hazards or priority when Greninja is in from users such as Scarf Volkraken, Colossoil's Sucker Punch, or Water Shuriken from opposing Greninja's.

Team Options
========

  • Greninja's most powerful move is Hydro Pump and Greninja will want to use as often as possible so having Pokemon that can take out opposing bulky Water-types like Toxapex and Arghonaut such as Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, and Magnezone make for excellent partners. In return, Greninja can apply a hefty amount of pressure on the Ground-types that might switch into Volt Switch or KO some Fire-types that Bulu does not like letting in.
  • Tapu Lele is an interesting partner as it threatens many of Greninja switchins such as Mega Venusaur, Toxapex, and Arghonaut but it also provides priority protection and the ability to OHKO Toxapex from full with Extrasensory if Greninja desires to lure it, but you must be wary of using Water Shurkien while Psychic Terrain is up.
  • Kartana is also a great partner to point out as they can both gang up on similar checks such as Keldeo, Toxapex, and Celesteela while providing overall great type synergy with Greninja checking most of the offensive Fire-types that resist Swords Dance Kartana's moves such as Volcarona and Victini and Kartana can threaten all the common Water-types with just Leaf Blade.
  • Hazard setters like Ferrothorn, Landorus-T, and Skarmory help to make Greninja even harder to switch into and combine well with Greninja's Spikes to wear down teams fast.
  • Bulky Grass-types like the previously mentioned Ferrothorn and Pyroak help to switch into the Water-types that want to come in on Greninja as well as tank Tapu Koko when Greninja has not transformed or is locked into a Dark Pulse.
  • Tapu Koko as well as other Electric-type help to beat bulky Water-types. Greninja also appreciates the Volt Switch switch ins and in favor can threaten the Ground-types that want to come in on Greninja's STAB. Tapu Koko as well as Tapu Bulu can also help to overwrite Psychic Terrain and make your Water Shuriken available to use

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

  • Ice Beam gives Greninja the ability to chip down some Pokemon that would switch into its STAB like Tapu Bulu and Malaconda, but Spikes also accomplishes the same thing over time while also chipping down other Pokemon such as Arghonaut
  • Surf is a more accurate alternative but trades power and makes some matches harder due to not being able to get the first KO for Battle Bond to activate.
  • Extransensory is actually nice option for Greninja. For one it hits most of Greninja's switchins such as Toxapex, Mollux, and Keldeo and can also pave a way for other teammates as well.
  • Waterium Z gives pre-Battle Bond Greninja to pick up an easy KO on an unsuspecting target but Greninja loses a lot of its fire power that the Choice Specs gives it.
  • Life Orb gives it free range to change up moves but with Greninja's fraility and the lack of fire power to miss some 2HKOs on Pokemon like Celesteela it isn't really worth it.
  • Choice Scarf can give the ability to literally outspeed every viable scarfer after Battle Bond and most prior but Greninja might struggle to pick up a KO for Battle Bond and it just isn't as threatening as Choice Specs and Choice Scarf is usually outdone by Protean Greninja.

Checks and Counters
===================

**Bulky Water Resist or Immunities**: Greninja's most spammable and valuable move is Hydro Pump so Pokemon that naturally want to switch into it pose a huge problem. Keldeo and Toxapex don't mind switching into it but others such as Plasmanta, Mollux, and Mantine actually benefit off of it and can give the opponent free turns.

**Arghonaut**: Arghonaut is one of the best counters for Greninja due to resisting both STABs, being able to revenge kill it with Mach Punch, or even use it as set up fodder. Arghonaut must be wary of the rare Extrasensory though as it can deal a large amount of damage to it and more so if Psychic Terrain is up because Arghonaut cannot revenge kill Greninja with Mach Punch.

**Faster Pokemon**: Because Greninja is so frail, Choice Scarf users won't have too much trouble picking it off even if it is a neutral move. Prime examples would be Pokemon like Kartana, Latios, and Mollux who are all specially notable because they resist Water Shuriken. Some other Pokemon such as Hawlucha in Electric Terrain and a few notable mega evolutions like Mega Lopunny and Mega Aerodactyl all outspeed it as well and prior to transformation, Tapu Koko and Weavile do outspeed its base form as well but they are also prone to Water Shuriken and are outsped after transformation.

**Specially Defensive Pokemon**: While not all specially defensive Pokemon can take two Hydro Pumps in Battle Bond form, some are still able to come in against Greninja prior to earning its first kill like Assault Vest Magearna and Mew are able to threaten it out.

**Priority**: Because of Greninja's fraility, strong priority attacks like Choice Band Zygarde's Extremespeed, Revenankh's Drain Punch, and Mega Pinsir's Quick Attack can all pick off Greninja if weakened enough.
 
Last edited:

snake

is a Community Leaderis a Top CAP Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
CAP Co-Leader
[OVERVIEW]

  • Extremely potent late game cleaner with the unique niche of keeping its 'boost' even after switching out
  • Powerful STABs that hit most of the tier at least neutrally
  • An insane speed tier that outspeed most Pokemon even before Battle Bond.
  • A unique niche in being able to gain a stat boost that last throughout the entirety of the match. you say this already in the first section
  • Is very frail and vulnerable to hazards
  • Sort of struggles prior to getting Battle Bond why? low damage output (cannot 2HKO what?) and lower speed (outsped by Koko, etc)
  • mention that ash-gren actually has some concrete counters (ik Argho basically counters, or is a huge stop)

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Hydro Pump / Surf
move 2: Dark Pulse
move 3: Water Shuriken
move 4: Spikes / Ice Beam
item: Choice Specs
ability: Battle Bond
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
  • Hydro Pump is Greninja's hardest hitting STAB and is its safest bet on getting the KOs it needs.
  • Surf is a more accurate alternative but trades power and makes some matches harder due to not being able to get the first KO for Battle Bond to activate. In a metagame where balance is very bulky, I'd drop this to a mention or OO. Hydro Pump's extra power is just that useful
  • Dark Pulse allows Greninja to hit targets that would normally resist Water such as Water and Dragon-types such as Rotom-W and Latios drop in Necturna
  • Water Shuriken gives Greninja some of the fastest priority moves in the whole metagame and allows pre-Battle Bond Greninja to revenge kill some faster threats such as Tapu Koko and Syclant syclant isn't faster, replace with stratagem
  • Spikes allows Greninja to capitalize on the many switches it forces and can pave a way for itself in the future but requires a huge amount of prediction to use. i think you're underestimating spikes here, it whittles down Ash-gren's few defensive switch-ins. generally, it's easy to force something out early game and set up spikes while the counter enters
  • Ice Beam, while also requiring a fair amount of prediction, gives Greninja the ability to chip down some Pokemon that would switch into its STAB like Tapu Bulu and Malaconda. not really sure about this being here either - again, spikes are huge
Set Details
========

  • Choice Specs and maximum Special Attack investment allows Greninja to hit as hard as possible.
  • 252 Speed and a Timid nature allows Greninja to outspeed some crucial Pokemon like Tapu Koko after Battle Bond
  • Battle Bond itself gives Greninja a boost to its most important stats after securing a KO change this so it reads how Greninja transforms into Greninja-Ash, not greninja gainings boosts. sounds like it gains a +2 boost.

Usage Tips
========

  • Unlike most sweepers, Greninja's 'set-up' is doesn't get reset after switching out so making sure Greninja can transform as early as possible puts you in the best position.
  • When hard counters are present like Toxapex are present try to restrict your use of Greninja or use it as a lure to bring in something that threatens the predicted switch in. definitely mention arghonaut here
  • Greninja is a very prediction heavy Pokemon in the early game so make sure to consider what move you use when Pokemon that can switch into Greninja's STABs are still present. This is especially true when Greninja has not transformed yet so try to use Spikes to weaken Greninja counters for later. Good prediction is key to getting Greninja's transformation. explain here that spikes is usually the best play early-game so that it's easier to launch hydro pumps late-game
  • Greninja despises any form of chip damage as its very fragile. Avoid taking unnecessary damage from hazards or priority when Greninja is in. give an example of some sort of priority move, a scarfer's resisted hit, and/or a weaker mon's move that it'd be able to live against
  • Protect users like Celesteela are annoying, don't waste Hydro Pumps unless you have to

Team Options
========

  • Greninja's most powerful move is Hydro Pump and Greninja will want to use as often as possible so having Pokemon that can take out bulky Water-types such as Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, and Magnezone it sounds like you're naming examples of the water-types here...also make sure to mention examples of water-types make for excellent partners. In return, Greninja can apply a hefty amount of pressure on the Ground-types that might switch into Volt Switch or KO some Fire-types that Bulu does not like letting in.
  • Tapu Lele is an interesting partner as it threatens many of Greninja switchins such as Mega Venusaur, Toxapex, and Arghonaut but it also provides priority protection and the ability to OHKO Toxapex from full with Extrasensory if Greninja desires to lure it. agreed, but you must mention that you have to be extremely careful if you need to use water shuriken
  • Kartana is also a great partner to point out as they can both gang up on similar checks such as Keldeo, Toxapex, and Celesteela while providing overall great type synergy with Greninja checking most of the offensive Fire-types that resist Swords Dance Kartana's moves such as Volcarona and Victini and Kartana can threaten all the common Water-types with just Leaf Blade.
  • Hazard setters like Ferrothorn, Landorus-T, and Skarmory help to make Greninja even harder to switch into and combine well with Greninja's Spikes to wear down teams fast.
  • Bulky Grass-types like the previously mentioned Ferrothorn and Pyroak help to switch into the Water-types that want to come in on Greninja as well as tank Tapu Koko when Greninja has not transformed or is locked into a Dark Pulse.
  • Tapu Koko as well as other Electric-type help to beat bulky Water-types. Greninja also appreciates the Volt Switch switch ins and in favor can threaten the Ground-types that want to come in on Greninja's STAB.
mention that koko and bulu can overwrite an opposing lele's psychic terrain

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

  • Extransensory is actually nice option for Greninja. For one it hits most of Greninja's switchins such as Toxapex, Mollux, and Keldeo and can also pave a way for other teammates as well. arghonaut mention here
  • Waterium Z gives pre-Battle Bond Greninja to pick up an easy KO on an unsuspecting target but Greninja loses a lot of its fire power that the Choice Specs gives it.
  • Life Orb gives it free range to change up moves but with Greninja's fraility and the lack of fire power to miss some 2HKOs on Pokemon like Celesteela it isn't really worth it. I don't really see this being worth OO. You mention that it's weak to hazards and shouldn't be chipping itself down, and this kinda does it for you
  • Choice Scarf can give the ability to literally outspeed every viable scarfer after Battle Bond and most prior but Greninja might struggle to pick up a KO for Battle Bond and it just isn't as threatening as Choice Specs. i've never seen this...ever. do you have a replay of this in action?

Checks and Counters
===================

**Bulky Water Resist or Immunities**: Greninja's most spammable and valuable move is Hydro Pump so Pokemon that naturally want to switch into it pose a huge problem. Keldeo, Arghonaut, and Toxapex don't mind switching into it but others such as Plasmanta, Mollux, and Mantine actually benefit off of it and can give the opponent free turns. I'd actually separate Arghonaut into its own sentence; I know I've made a big deal of it, but when you counter freaking Ash-Greninja, have reliable recovery, and set hazards in response to gren, you have a solid mon. I'm pretty sure Plasmanta takes big damage from Dark Pulse though so make sure to make that distinction

**Faster Pokemon**: Because Greninja is so frail, Choice Scarf users won't have too much trouble picking it off even if it is a neutral move. Prime examples would be Pokemon like Kartana, Latios, and Mollux who are all specially notable because they resist Water Shuriken. Some other Pokemon such as Hawlucha in Electric Terrain and a few notable mega evolutions like Mega Lopunny and Mega Aerodactyl all outspeed it as well and prior to transformation, Tapu Koko and Weavile do outspeed its base form as well but they are also prone to Water Shuriken and are outsped after transformation.

**Specially Defensive Pokemon**: While not all specially defensive Pokemon can take two Hydro Pumps in Battle Bond form, some are still able to come in against Greninja prior to earning its first kill like Assault Vest Magearna and Mew are able to threaten it out.

**Priority**: Because of Greninja's fraility, strong priority attacks like Tomohawk's Nature Power remove this, Ash-Greninja eats this due to Prankster immunity, Revenankh's Drain Punch, and Mega Pinsir's Quick Attack can all pick off Greninja if weakened enough. put in Choice Band Zygarde Extreme Speed instead
fyi please reply when you've put a WIP into QC or done any updates to your analysis, so that QC members may know.

I want to stamp after a second look when I'm not so tired, so let me know when you implement and I'll look again
 

HeaLnDeaL

Let's Keep Fighting
is an Artistis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
snake_rattler sounds like you offered a conditional QC check so I need you to approve it by giving it more comments/a stamp before the other QC members can dive into it next.
 

snake

is a Community Leaderis a Top CAP Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
CAP Co-Leader
snake_rattler sounds like you offered a conditional QC check so I need you to approve it by giving it more comments/a stamp before the other QC members can dive into it next.
Sorry about that. Let me get on to that in a few minutes. I'll edit it into this post and alert Azelfie.

EDIT:
[OVERVIEW]

  • Extremely potent late game cleaner with the unique niche of keeping its 'boost' even after switching out explain what this means clearly, that it undergoes a form change
  • Powerful STABs that hit most of the tier at least neutrally
  • An insane speed tier that outspeed most Pokemon even before Battle Bond. what advantage does this provide for gren
  • mention water shuriken in here, that's a very useful tool for it
  • Is very frail and vulnerable to hazards give some metric to indicate how frail it is - is it koed by unresisted priority? does it get OHKOed by some "powerful resisted hits"?
  • Sort of struggles prior to getting Battle Bond due to being outsped by Tapu Koko and having a lower damage output that fails to get some 2HKOes.
  • Some Pokemon can switch into Greninja with no fear such as Toxapex or Arghonaut. say that it has some common, sturdy checks and counters that can prevent it from transforming

[SET]
name: Choice Specs
move 1: Hydro Pump
move 2: Dark Pulse
move 3: Water Shuriken
move 4: Spikes
item: Choice Specs
ability: Battle Bond
nature: Timid
evs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
  • Hydro Pump is Greninja's hardest hitting STAB and is its safest bet on getting the KOs it needs.
  • Dark Pulse allows Greninja to hit targets that would normally i'd get rid of "normally" - it's not like they suddenly don't resist Water-type attacks after Dark Pulse is added to the moveset resist Water such as Water and Dragon-types such as Rotom-W, Necturna, Latios
  • Water Shuriken gives Greninja some of the fastest priority moves in the whole metagame specifically water shuriken allows gren to hit... and allows pre-Battle Bond Greninja to revenge kill some faster threats such as Tapu Koko and Stratagem
  • Spikes allows Greninja to capitalize on the many switches it forces and can pave a way for itself in the future make it clear that you use it to wear down counters like Toxapex and Arghonaut, but requires some prediction
Set Details
========

  • Choice Specs and maximum Special Attack EV (you aren't running modest, so make it clear) investment allows Greninja to hit as hard as possible. choice specs is most useful because it allows base Gren to have more power to nab that kill without chipping yourself down with LO, and then let Ash-Greninja hit absurdly hard. Make both of these points clear.
  • 252 Speed EVs and a Timid nature allows Greninja to outspeed some crucial Pokemon like Tapu Koko after Battle Bond
  • Battle Bond itself transforms Greninja into Ash-Greninja and gives it a boost to its most important stats name these as Special Attack and Speed after securing a KO.

Usage Tips
========

  • Unlike most sweepers, Greninja's 'set-up' is doesn't get reset after switching out so making sure Greninja can transform as early as possible puts you in the best position.
  • When hard counters are present like Arghonaut and Toxapex are present try to restrict your use of Greninja or use it as a lure to bring in something that threatens the predicted switch in. really you use it when you want to threaten a KO and then use Spikes on the switch-in, unless it's a serious loss of momentum, you explain this much better in the next point - this bullet just seems flimsy and doesn't add much
  • Greninja is a very prediction heavy Pokemon in the early game so make sure to consider what move you use when Pokemon that can switch into Greninja's STABs are still present. This is especially true when Greninja has not transformed yet so try to use Spikes to weaken Greninja counters for later. Good prediction is key to getting Greninja's transformation. Spikes is usually used best in the early game to make sweeping with Hydro Pump easier in the late game.
  • Greninja despises any form of chip damage as its very fragile. Avoid taking unnecessary damage from hazards or priority when Greninja is in from users such as Scarf Volkraken, Colossoil's Sucker Punch, or Water Shuriken from opposing Greninja's. this isn't what I meant in my last check - the point was that taking the unnecessary damage can put gren into range of a priority attack, such as X, Y, and Z

Team Options
========

  • Greninja's most powerful move is Hydro Pump and Greninja will want to use as often as possible so having Pokemon that can take out opposing bulky Water-types like Toxapex and Arghonaut such as Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, and Magnezone make for excellent partners. this sounds confusing - "so having Pokemon that can take out opposing bulky Water-types like Toxapex and Arghonaut such as Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, and Magnezone" - I can see it on the second read but on the first time around its weird when you're listing examples and then listing more examples straight after that - fix this prose to be more clear. Also, you don't run Magnezone specifically to get rid of bulky Water-types - though magnezone can trap AV magearna and ferrothorn, so separate this example into its own sentence. In place of Magnezone, put Zapdos or something else In return, Greninja can apply a hefty amount of pressure on the Ground-types that might switch into Volt Switch or KO some Fire-types that Bulu does not like letting in.
  • Tapu Lele is an interesting partner as it threatens many of Greninja switchins such as Mega Venusaur, Toxapex, and Arghonaut but it also provides priority protection and the ability to OHKO Toxapex from full with Extrasensory if Greninja desires to lure it, but you must be wary of using Water Shurkien while Psychic Terrain is up.
  • Kartana is also a great partner to point out as they can both gang up on similar checks such as Keldeo, Toxapex, and Celesteela while providing overall great type synergy with Greninja checking most of the offensive Fire-types that resist Swords Dance Kartana's moves such as Volcarona and Victini and Kartana can threaten all the common Water-types with just Leaf Blade.
  • Hazard setters like Ferrothorn, Landorus-T, and Skarmory help to make Greninja even harder to switch into and combine well with Greninja's Spikes to wear down teams fast. does skarm ever appear on the same build that ash-gren would? confused about this. Also, if these are supposed to be Stealth Rock setters, specify that
  • Bulky Grass-types like the previously mentioned Ferrothorn and Pyroak help to switch into the Water-types that want to come in on Greninja as well as tank Tapu Koko's Electric-type moves when Greninja has not transformed or is locked into a Dark Pulse.
  • Tapu Koko as well as other Electric-type help to beat bulky Water-types. Greninja also appreciates the Volt Switch switch ins and in favor can threaten the Ground-types that want to come in on Greninja's STAB. Tapu Koko as well as Tapu Bulu can also help to overwrite Psychic Terrain and make your Water Shuriken available to use move this point closer to when you mention these mons in the first bullet point of this section
  • Add a couple of physical wallbreakers that can break past some of Ash-Gren's special checks / counters - you haven't mentioned what busts past Chansey
I think this section needs a little reworking than just tacking on more examples - this really be compressed down some

[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

  • Ice Beam gives Greninja the ability to chip down some Pokemon that would switch into its STAB like Tapu Bulu and Malaconda, but Spikes also accomplishes the same thing over time while also chipping down other Pokemon that resist this move such as Arghonaut
  • Add U-turn here
  • Surf is a more accurate alternative but trades power and makes some matches harder due to not being able to get the first KO for Battle Bond to activate.
  • Extransensory is actually nice option for Greninja. For one it hits most of Greninja's switchins such as Toxapex, Mollux, and Keldeo and can also pave a way for other teammates as well. what are the downsides of running the move? it's largely opportunity cost of not running one of the main set's moves
  • Waterium Z gives pre-Battle Bond Greninja to pick up an easy KO on an unsuspecting target what does it KO that Choice Specs does not? but Greninja loses a lot of its fire power that the Choice Specs gives it. mention that it's a decent option mostly on Rain teams
  • Life Orb gives it free range to change up moves but with Greninja's fraility and the lack of fire power to miss some 2HKOs on Pokemon like Celesteela it isn't really worth it. you also just scrape away gren's health trying to pick up that KO, add this downside when you talk about Greninja's frailty
  • Choice Scarf can give the ability to literally outspeed every viable scarfer after Battle Bond and most prior but Greninja might struggle to pick up a KO for Battle Bond and it just isn't as threatening as Choice Specs and Choice Scarf is usually outdone by Protean Greninja. remove this - this sounds so hard to use and doesn't seem that worth it at all

Checks and Counters
===================

**Bulky Water Resists or Immunities**: Greninja's most spammable and valuable move is Hydro Pump so Pokemon that naturally want to switch into it pose a huge problem. Keldeo and Toxapex don't mind switching into it but others such as Plasmanta, Mollux, and Mantine actually benefit off of it and can give the opponent free turns. plasmanta gets chunked by Dark Pulse, and mention that these mons allow Gren to get a free layer of spikes in

**Arghonaut**: Arghonaut is one of the best counters for Greninja due to resisting both STABs, being able to revenge kill it with Mach Punch, or even use it as set up fodder. Arghonaut must be wary of the rare Extrasensory though as it can deal a large amount of damage to it and more so if Psychic Terrain is up because Arghonaut cannot revenge kill Greninja with Mach Punch. Argho...never runs Mach Punch. Remove any mentions of Mach Punch. Say that Arghonaut can hit it hard with Circle Throw and phaze it out. Also, put Arghonaut as the first section

**Faster Pokemon**: Because Greninja is so frail, Choice Scarf users won't have too much trouble picking it off even if it is a neutral move. Prime examples would be Pokemon like Kartana, Latios, and Mollux who are all specially notable because they resist Water Shuriken. Some other Pokemon such as Hawlucha in Electric Terrain and a few notable mega evolutions like Mega Lopunny and Mega Aerodactyl don't mention mega Aerodactyl all outspeed it as well and prior to transformation, Tapu Koko and Weavile do outspeed its base form as well but they are also prone to Water Shuriken's priority and are outsped after transformation.

**Specially Defensive Pokemon**: While not all specially defensive Pokemon can take two Hydro Pumps in Battle Bond form, some are still able to come in against Greninja prior to earning its first kill like Assault Vest Magearna and Mew are able to threaten it out. Add Assault Vest Tapu Bulu, Ferrothorn, Pyroak, and Chansey

**Priority**: Because of Greninja's frailty, strong priority attacks like Choice Band Zygarde's Extremespeed Extreme Speed, Triage Revenankh's Drain Punch, and Mega Pinsir's Quick Attack can all pick off Greninja if weakened enough.
I had to comment on a lot of stuff here so I'm holding my stamp until I see this check implemented properly.

Also, be sure to be clear when you mean Greninja and Ash-Greninja.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top