RarelyUsed CCAT - SS Omastar - Revision

atomicllamas

but then what's left of me?
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Would you look at that, I am so hipster I submitted Mesprit last round, however, I no longer think that Mesprit is the best fit for the team, I also considered Braviary, but it leaves us with a huge problem against stuff with edge-quake coverage, especially Rhydon with enough speed creep, Aerodactyl, offenisve Aggron and Hitmonlee. We definitely need rocks at this point, as well as something that can take on things with edge-quake coverage, so my proposal is Torterra.



Torterra @ Leftovers
Trait: Overgrow
EVs: 96 Spd / 212 HP / 44 Atk / 156 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Seed Bomb
- Earthquake
- Synthesis

This set may look odd, but it is just the standard RU defensive set with enough speed creep to get around min speed Lanturn, something which may give the other mons on this team trouble (Omastar with volt switch and its special bulk, Escavalier with scald, and Lanturns can't touch each other). This also provides our team with stealth rocks, an obvious necessity at this point. Torterra and Lanturn (and Esca to some extent) form an excellent defensive core on this team, as Torterra can take the Ground moves aimed at Lanturn, while Lanturn (and everything) can take the ice type moves aimed at Torterra, Flying type moves are also resisted by Lanturn, and fire type moves are drawn in for Omastar. Yeah, Torterra is a great fit for the current team.
 
Options here;

Double Spiker Scolipede
Support Mesprit
Offensive Quiver Dance Lilligant
Support Druddigon
Choice Scarf Mesprit
Choice Scarf Braviary
Support Torterra


Everyone gets 2 votes. You must use all of your votes. Your votes must be on separate submissions and any order. You can vote your own set.

rest of the team in the op
 

EonX

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Support Torterra
Support Mesprit

Really don't like voting for my own set, but we really need things that can handle EdgeQuake coverage and Lanturn right now. These two do the best at doing that imo. Both also give SR support, so we don't have to worry about that later on either.
 

Kushalos

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Support druddigon
Support Torterra<this thing is going to win lol


And now its time to go look for some fighting resistances :X
 
Winner is Torterra support here;




Torterra @ Leftovers
Trait: Overgrow
EVs: 96 Spd / 212 HP / 44 Atk / 156 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Seed Bomb
- Earthquake
- Synthesis

Submit R5 Submissions begin.

Rules / Reminders:

  • Submissions end 3-4 days from now.
  • There are no more slashes on Pokemon sets. Different slashes can take a team in different directions.
  • You will be unable to change the submission in anyway after the deadline until the revision rounds. So if there are any suggested changes are you set (moves, EV's, etc.) do it before the submission deadline!
  • Refer back to the OP for the main rules, format, and reminders.
  • When you submit your set, think about how it contributes to the function of the team. Also think about what direction you beleive the team should go, and reflect that in the submitted set.
  • Don't just let submissions be the only contribution to this round.
Check the rest of the team in the OP.
 
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really keep lilligant in mind from now on, it completely screws over this team. we have stealth rock now, which is cool, so stuff like roselia, druddigon, amoonguss, emboar and entei could mabye start to be considered? lilligant gets a free switch in on both torterra and lanturn, and sets up with impunity. while it can't come in on the snails, neither of them can obviously come in on it if it's an hp fire variant, and it can proceed to ohko both. both of the next team members need to be able to deal with lilligant at all costs

im not calling out the lanturn and torterra noms, as they do help against other threats, but both of them are completely unable to deal with grass types, which is obviously problematic for omastar. sceptile is another pokemon that can pretty much blow through this team if it's played well with hazards / has hp fire. the team is also slow as balls at the moment, which means that pretty much everything is forced to take a hit, and only torterra has recovery. everything is grounded as well, so spikes do a number on the team.
 
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Ok, so I got peer pressured into posting, but I guess I had to voice my issues at some point anyway. Basically, I've been concerned with the direction this CCAT has been taking since the Lanturn pick (sorry Molk, nothing against you, I hope you understand :[ ). I strongly feel as though we as a community really jumped the gun on incorporating a defensive pivot such as Lanturn onto the team without really recognizing why we were doing so; as soon as Cherub mentioned the Moltres weakness, everybody jumped on the paranoia bandwagon (I mean, I know it's basically team-building with Cherub and whatever, but we're all sentient beings too, yeah? ;( ), and this can be reflected nicely in the Lanturn pick. If you think about it, what is Lanturn doing besides switching into Moltres (probably only once, unless we're gonna be splurging for Wish support lol)? It's checking a decent handful of 'mons and stopping Volt Switch, yeah, but it's just way too clunky for a team of this nature to not be providing anything beyond some generalized defensive pivot. It retains next to no offensive presence (which slows down the team a ton from an offensive outlook), Heal Bell support on what should very well be a pretty offensively inclined team is very rarely worth a moveslot, and it's best way of deterring set-up is Scald. It doesn't even pack Protect, so EBelt Electric-types can still run train on the team unless we do a ton of excessive scouting, and considering how naturally such Pokemon pair with Spikes this means we'd basically be letting everything take chip damage while the opp can essentially just click buttons and do relatively well. I could mention the other issues this sorta a pick develops (hp fire lilli as cherub mentions, offensive drudd just comes in an wears down our only method of combatting oma's checks / counters, etc.), but I don't think that's necessary tbh.

tl;dr, this team took a defensive stance far too quickly and without considering the ramifications of such a shift, when it should've been taking the time to focus on offensive synergy and opening a window for an oma sweep. This isn't to say that posts like Cherub makes wherein they detail threats to the current team should be ignored, as they are largely valuable to making an effective final product. However, these issues shouldn't immediately be counteracted with the first 'mon listed in the C&C section of their analysis, because that sorta thinking doesn't reflect well upon the team itself. Note there are other methods of mitigating threats, such as preventing such Pokemon from acquiring the free turns necessary to pose a threat, and even those that cannot be solved this way can be solved in later picks, when we have a pretty clear-cut way of setting up an oma sweep, perhaps an alternative win-con or two in case that falls through, etc. I know we're kinda stuck as is, but I'd like you to give this some consideration for future picks, and perhaps in the editing stage we could fix some things in order to better reflect this.

However, for now:
10:25 hotncold someone submit emboar now
10:25 hotncold col49
10:25 hotncold submit emboar
10:25 hotncold yn
10:25 hotncold for lilli / durant / esca



Emboar @ Choice Scarf | Blaze
Jolly | 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Flare Blitz | Superpower | Sleep Talk | Wild Charge

I'm not going to say that Emboar is "mandatory" for this team, but in it's current state we really need some kinda gluemon for this team, and Emboar is the most effectual 'mon for this purpose. As HnC kindly points out, this team faces great difficulty with Lilligant, Durant, and Escavalier, all of whom find quite a few opportunities to come in and pose a significant threat to the team; HP Fire Lilligant can outright beat every member of the team 1v1 (and HP Rock variants+Magnets cause similar issues unless we're expected to be going into Esca on Lilli, doubling to Tort on the Magneton switch, and repeating until SR wears Magneton down enough late Megahorn can take it out .-.), Durant finds a free turn v.Tort+Esca to an extent and OHKOs everything from there iirc, and Esca just comes in just 2HKO's / OHKOs everything (252+ Atk Choice Band Escavalier Megahorn vs. 168 HP / 0 Def Escavalier: 159-187 (49.22 - 57.89%) -- 97.66% chance to 2HKO). It also offers an alternative win-con to some extent, since we pack Pursuit support for Slowking and enough means to wear down other Fire- and Water-types moderately well, so there's that. Doubling up on Sleep Talk users is somewhat excessive imo, but it's not like Emboar has anything it'd rather be running anywho, so the extra insurance is there.

Sorry for the apathetic tone of the 'nom, I really made the effort to rephrase things, but nothing was coming readily to mind.
 

Kushalos

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tbh i never think Lanturn shouldve been on this team but now we're gonna have scarf Emboar so im happy again :>
 
GDI i had this entire post written up and it got deleted ugh.

(pls tell me im not the only one who thinks hes fappin with his left hand)
Durrdigon @ Life Orb
Trait: Sheer Force
216 HP / 252 Atk / 20 SpA / 20 Spe
Lonely Nature
-Outrage
-Flamethrower
-Earthquake
-Rock Slide

Ugh here we go again. Durrdigon handles a lot of threats to our team very well. We currently have a lot of trouble with Grass types and Fire types to some extent (Sun decimates us as of now) and Druddigon handles Sun pretty damn well. We lure Steel Types like Durant/Escavalier/Steelix and burn their shiny metal asses. Lanturn's Cleric Support really helps out here so we don't have to run Sub. Rock Slide hits Moltres and gets SF boost and gives us SlideQuake. I think SF Drudd would be a great Glue for the team as of now.
 
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Molk

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Sorry about Lanturn :[

I know this was actually proposed earlier for another teamslot by detective scruffy (if this submission wins he should definitely get some credit, js), but i think this is actually a p. good alternative to emboar (although Emboar is really solid for this team lol), especially given our latest Choice in torterra, which makes a way to deal with Hp Fire lilligant all the more valuable.


Braviary (M) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Defiant
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Adamant Nature
- Brave Bird
- Return
- Superpower
- U-turn

Choice Scarf Braviary seems like it'd be a pretty nice fit to our current team at the moment because of its combination of power, bulk, and Speed, just like Emboar. As mentioned by quite a few other users above, this team struggles quite a bit with Grass-type Pokemon that carry Hidden Power Fire such as Lilligant and Sceptile, and Braviary performs pretty well against them, outspeeding both of them at +0 (+1 Lilligant Outspeeds but can't KO with +1 Hidden Power Fire after Stealth Rock) and threatening an immediate OHKO with Brave Bird. Unlike say Emboar though, Braviary has another trick up its sleeve that could be quite helpful: U-turn. This makes it quite easy for Braviary to grab momentum during the match with the switches it forces against the Pokemon it's meant to deal with, and can give us an immediate advantage quite easily, especially because nothing's immune to the move like with say Volt Switch. Speaking of Volt Switch, Braviary actually makes a really solid volturn core with Lanturn, being immune to the Ground-type moves that Lanturn hates as well as checking the Grass-types, while Lanturn is immune to Electric-type moves and resists Ice-type moves that might be aimed at Braviary, making the two a natural pair (Lanturn hits Rock-types such as Rhydon super effectively with Scald too, which is nice, Omastar and Kabutops can't immediately KO Lanturn without a boost and get scared out by Volt Switch too). Lastly, despite not having access to a good Fire-type move, Braviary is still capable of revenge killing a weakened Durant quite effectively, as Brave Bird comes quite close to OHKOing after Stealth Rock. Overall while i'm not sure if its the perfect fit compared to say Emboar, Choice Scarf Braviary does seem pretty solid on this team, and i'd definitely give it some consideration.
 

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