well since this topic is apparently the place for the improvement discussion, I was thinken of bringing this one thing up again;
Could it be possible to get more ladder variation?
I mean, really, even tho the current perma ladders are solid and give a good taste of the OMs and we have the OMtM which is really great, it still feels like some metagames that have shown great potential to continue forward and specially the ones that get nominated a lot could do with atleast longer ladder time if they cannot get perma ladder
It could help to spice things up a bit.
Like idk, seasonal/featured ladders or something for those all time favorites that still cant get perma ladder?
Cause one month is a short time and I feel that some potential new players that just notice the OMtM and then see it gone might get disappointment feelings when the next OMtM they see is nothing alike or as fun. Or the case where some players might get the "this again?" feel.
It could help with giving new fresher and different meta games a chance to pop in OMtM more.
(as exsample you could look back at inheritance and how it was super active as OMtM and how it attracted people who were not interested in OMs a lot at first, I recall also has shown this effect)
I can say with certainty that the biggest problem with higher end OM players not participating in OMotMs is that they don't last long enough and tend to be unstable for a long time. These players prefer to play the permaladders, whatever they are and even if they have more interest in the non-permas, over the OMotMs because of this lack of stability. True stability doesn't usually exist until late in the period, and really, creativity and solid teambuilding comes after a prolonged period of stability in the metagame. This is just as much of a symptom of a lack of playtesting prior to these metas becoming OMotM meaning they require several bans as it is the lack of time.
Having more popular OMotMs or LCotMs go into a rotating ladder cycle could help fix this issue. Regardless, the popularity for these ladders would be a major contributor in giving them extended ladder period. One of the main reasons I am concerned now is that we are apparently planning on using MnM and Sketchmons as permaladders in Sun and Moon when neither meta, especially the latter, is stable. Both metas were still in the process of stabilizing their bans at the end of the last OMotMs and Sketchmons especially still had issues that needed to be addressed, and now the metagame without diggersby is completely unexplored. For metagames that aren't getting a permaladder, even the greatest metagames bear no resemblance to stability even by the end of the month, deadening the interest in these metagames to begin with.
Realistically, I can understand not wanting to "clog the server" so to speak but several ladders have been added since the inception of X and Y and I don't see why we couldn't add two 3-month ladders of the most popular OMotM/LCotMs or some similar system, especially when sumo comes out.
More importantly, there are some ladders that won't get permas due to being parallel with other metas but would fit very well in an extended OMotM system due to their popularity. Primarily, I'm referring to Inheritance, which, according to the admins, is parallel with BH (I still don't understand this comparison at all). Inheritance was right up there with MnM and Sketchmons in popularity, with the other two receiving permaladders. Even if this Inheritance vs. BH comparison holds up or is valid, running such a popular meta in a cycle longer than a month every 6 months is probably more than appropriate given its extreme popularity.
I'm all for more mods. It's something TI and I have been discussing since literally we became co-leaders. We just can't seem to agree on the same candidates, or then when we do, they go inactive or quit.
For a completely different topic, this is my biggest pet peeve with management on any online forum. I know there are plenty of candidates for mod and I don't pretend to understand what you and TI think about when discussing candidates, but I have a feeling you guys are overthinking it to some extent. When looking to appoint moderators, you don't need to look for every quality being
perfect, as if those candidates have to fit every qualification to the bill and be the perfect user in order to be considered for anything. The biggest part about being a mod of a forum like this, in which the moderators cannot keep up with the content, is maintaining a level head and being able to take criticism, including understanding you will make mistakes and trying to learn from them. No matter what you do or who you employ, that person will make mistakes in the early going. People with the ability to do this, and keep a level-head in these situations, are the candidates for moderator. They don't need to be elite battlers, constant contributors, or staff helpers if you will; they need to be smart people who can keep a level head, maintain activity, and monitor forums you can't.
I can say with some certainty that if you made
Zangooser a moderator, there would be absolutely no drawbacks for the OM forums or you as a staff group, and he brings an understanding of AG and several other tiers you guys haven't delved into yet, from what I see (sorry if I'm wrong here). I'm not really sure what your knock on him is now. There are several other similar candidates who you KNOW would absolutely do the job every way you want it done. Baconbagon and Peef Rimgar immediately come to mind especially as I know them both personally, but I'm sure there are other candidates like E4 Flint that would preform similarly well.
I'm not trying to tell you and TI how to do your jobs, and like I said, I do not pretend to understand what you guys are actually doing, and whether or not you're thinking the same things I am or are concerned about details I'm missing. I'm just approaching the subject because I feel like it needs to be said and could potentially save you much more headache.
As long as this thread has become somewhat active again, I'm going to post about an important issue that I believe has resulted in a significant reduction of the quality of threads across the OM forum: the lack of deleted posts.
Anyone who has ever posted in an OU suspect thread knows that there is an incredibly high standard of quality that a post needs to meet to avoid being erased. We purport to have similar standards ourselves, but in practice, a lot of stupidity goes unchecked; in general, in my experience, the moderators choose to delete posts primarily when they result in excessive conflict, but innumerable uninformed, useless, and flat-out factually incorrect posts are allowed to survive. This frequently disrupts actually important conversation, most notably in threads like the BH suspect thread, since 5 people stop what they're doing to make corrections. Here are some
recent examples, solely within the BH arena (this phenomenon has persisted for as long as I can remember):
"
I've recently found out that Sturdy Shedinja can force Endless Battles" - interrupted a legitimately interesting discussion about the viability of Taunt, which ceased immediately after, and necessitated two posts asking how. No response from the creator of the post, who succeeded in derailing something important.
"
Thanks to Balanced Hackmons, not only can magikarp fear sweep, but at full health" - This is something like the seventh time this exact same unviable meme strategy has been touted as "overpowered," and every time it leads to another elaborate explanation of why the unviable strategy is unviable that gets 5 likes.
"
I don't know if this will fit in, but I think there is a clear problem with putting sturdy on shedninja" - results in an 11-post discussion that includes mentions of Quick Claw Final Gambit Blissey and Quick Attack Shedinja and completely derails the previous discussion of sleep and -ates, legitimate issues that need to be addressed to improve the centralized BH metagame.
"
Swadloon" and then "
ray-mega (s->A-). this mon is easily nocked out by refrigirate users such as black kyuerem [among other things]" - these result in a long discussion of Kyurem-Black coverage that kills the thread for a month
We also see this in threads that explicitly mention that bad posts will be deleted. For instance:
Cheek Pouch Aggron-Mega
Anyway, I could probably find more but I've been working on this for way too long. My point is that we need to be much more harsh about deleting posts,
especially uninformed ones that come in the midst of elaborate, intelligent discussion. This would help with an overall problem we have with a general lack of intellectual discussion.
In my mind, not only are shitposts a problem, but one-liners as well, since many add little or nothing to the conversation and often require people to rehash their ideas repetitively. Even if something holds some relevance, one-liners are almost always going to qualify as shitposts in a competitive discussion, even if they appear to be useful in some way. Importantly, posts that are nothing but sets and a sentence are just as distracting.
I understand when moderators don't understand the tiers they are commenting on, but I don't think a 1-liner about imposter pikachu, or a single imposter pikachu set on a BH thread, should stay regardless of whether or not it's viable. If somebody has analysis as to why something is viable, let people address it. Most importantly,
communication between the moderators and those who are leaders or know the tier very well can help filter these posts. If as a moderator, you are unsure of whether or not something qualifies as a bad post, ask tier leaders or highly respected tier players if they think it should remain or if it's a bad post that doesn't deserve the spot on the thread for the negative potential it creates. Conversely, if you are a tier leader or a highly respected player and you see a post you deem as unworthy to remain on the thread, why not message an admin about it and ask them to delete it? We can't go around assuming everybody is right, but some sort of communication could help this issue regardless.
Been a while since I dropped a post like this. feelsgoodman