Grass Gym Team RMT (Need's help)

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Ich777ich

Hey ya'll, this is Ian posting his 3rd rmt here. This one is a little different, i have become a gym leader for a certain league sorta thing. I think this is considered an "Other Team" because it's a mono team, but if I'm wrong I'll move to the standard section. The type I got was Grass, so it's kinda hard to make a team for that. The Ratio for the team can be 4/2, 5/1, or 6/0, but with grass you definitely need to run a 4/2 to get more diverse. I need a bunch of help with this team, but I think I've made a good start. Keep in mind that this team is mainly offensive. Plz tell me whatcha think and gi ve any advice.

From Afar...

In-Depth (Changes in Bold)

Celebi@ Occa Berry
Ability: Natural Cure
EV's: 76 HP, 252 Sp.A 180 Speed
Nature: Modest
Moveset:
~Stealth Rock
~Leaf Storm
~Earth Power
~U-turn
Description: This is my lead for my grass team and it actually does really well as one. With great base defenses to support this offensive set, this Celebi holds up very well to a lot of standard pokemon. With it's good bulk it can even come on later and hit hard with it's great moves. Stealth rock is very beneficial to my heavily offensive team, and it's the best entry hazard. Leaf Storm is a great move, 210 base power with STAB factored in is always scary to any pokemon. This move 2HKO's any lead that doesn't resist it. Earth Power compliments leaf storm very well, dealing with opposing Metagross leads as well as any other steels and fire types. Uturn is a great move for scouting and one of the best in the game, especially on a lead. Main problems are uturn leads like infernape and jirachi, although the former is not usually seen. Occa berry allows celebi to take any fire attack and fight back with an earth power. Also is a great surprise later in the game if celebi is still at good health. Bring it in on a Heatran that just revenge killed and take the FB and then kill it back with Earth Power.
EV's/Nature: Modest Nature for max sp.a power. Ev's are standard on lead Celebi, max sp.a for power and 180 speed to outspeed 280 speed stat pokemon.

Roserade@ Choice Scarf
Ability: Natural Cure
EV's: 6 HP, 252 Sp.A, 252 Speed
Nature: Timid
Moveset:
~Leaf Storm
~Sludge Bomb
~Hidden Power Ice
~Rest/Sleep Powder
Description: This is the Roserade set I use as a revenge killer, and does a great job for me. Roserade has the highest Sp.A out of all Grass types in the game, and with a scarf it can revenge kill a lot of things easily. Leaf Storm coming off of such a high Sp.A absolutely murders anything that doesn't resist it. Sludge Bomb is a solid STAB move and is for dealing consistent damage. The last attack move is hard to decide on, but each of them deserve a mention. HP ice is the one I use currently, and it's a great way with dealing with dragons and flyers that are major threats to my team. HP fire gives Roserade a way to deal with steels not named Heatran that could wall this set, namely Skarmory, Metagross, Registeel, and Bronzong. HP ground is a way of dealing with 3 of the above pokemon, especially Heatran. However, I have more pokemon that have ground moves for taking out fire/steel types. The last move is also controversial, but rest+natural cure is a great way for restoring Roserade's health and with natural cure allows me to relieve myself of sleep. However, Sleep Powder is a great way for crippling any opposing pokemon.
EV's/Nature: The nature I use is Timid for outspeeding certain pokemon after a DD. EV's are for a special sweeper, with max speed and special attack.

Breloom@ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EV's: 44 HP, 252 Atk, 212 Speed
Nature: Adamant
Moveset:
~Spore
~Stone Edge
~Focus Punch
~Mach Punch
Description: Breloom is one of the most effective pokemon in the game when you bring it in correctly, sporting (what I think) the best move in the game as well as an awesome Atk stat. This is the basic standard moveset for Breloom, spore on something you're faster than and unleash a powerful Focus Punch the next turn (Even things that resist it take a large portion of damage from it). Stone Edge is great for hitting those Flying Intimidators (Like Salamence and Gyarados), that try and switch-in on the expected Focus Punch but end up getting hit with a powerful Super Effective Rock Attack. Mach Punch is for priority, which my team desperately needs. It also does a good amount of damage because of STAB and Breloom's awesome Atk stat.
EV's/Nature: Adamant nature for giving Breloom the highest attack it can. EV's are standard, max atk and enough speed to outspeed certain pokes. Rest into HP.

Torterra@ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EV's: 12 HP, 252 Atk, 244 Speed
Nature: Adamant
Moveset:
~Rock Polish
~Wood Hammer/Seed Bomb
~Earthquake
~Stone Edge
Description: I honestly had no idea how good this pokemon was until I tried it. RP Torterra does a great job in the standard metagame, being able to take on certain threats as well as having great attacks. After a Rock Polish, Torterra can outspeed any standard pokemon as well as scarf Heatran. Wood Hammer does tremendous damage to any pokemon that does not resist it, and makes a great suicide move for when Torterra get's an overgrow boost. Earthquake is a great move and is another STAB Torterra get's, hitting fires and steels that annoy this team. Stone Edge is to deal with flyers that can be annoying to this team, mainly Gyarados, Salamence, and Zapdos. Life Orb is for extra power that Torterra needs to get those 2HKO's and OHKO's in the standard metagame.
EV's/Nature: Adamant nature to max out it's attack. 252 Atk ev's to maximize attacking power. 244 speed allows Torterra to outspeed Scarf Heatran after a Rock Polish. The remainder is put into HP.

Heatran@ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EV's: 6 Atk, 252 Sp.A, 252 Speed
Nature: Timid/Naive
Moveset:
~Fire Blast
~Earth Power
~Substitute
~Dragon Pulse
Description: Though I'm not sure on what set to use, Heatran is by far the best pokemon to use on a mono grass team, resisting everything that grass is weak to (Ice, Flying, Poison, Bug, Fire). The moveset I went with was the sub+3 attacks one. Fire Blast is for STAB and does a lot of damage. Earth Power hit's many other pokemon for SE damage as well as other heatran. Substitute is a great move, and if the opponent thinks I'm scarfed I then get my chance to get behind a sub and decide what to use. It also allows me to kill opposing Heatran they might bring in to a take an expected fire attack. Explosion is a great way for me to take out capital pokemon that are very bulky and very annoying to my team, such as latias, and also allows me to deal with blissey. However, Dragon Pulse is a good option too for allowing me to hit Latias without killing myself as well as other dragons. I'm starting to lean towards more toward D-Pulse as well as a Timid Nature because Bliss is taken care of by Breloom or Torterra.
EV's/Nature: Timid nature to outspeed base 80's as well as positive speed natured based 70's. Max Speed and Sp.A to allow it to perform at it's best. Rest into HP.

Zapdos@ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EV's: 252 HP, 224 Def, 32 Speed
Nature: Bold
Moveset:
~Thunderbolt
~Heat Wave
~Toxic
~Roost
Description: Zapdos is my second and final wild card and does goes great on my team. Defensive Zapdos is one of the most annoying pokemon to take down with it's great immunities and resistances. Thunderbolt is for STAB and an overall good move. Heatwave compliments Thunderbolt and Toxic nicely hitting all pokemon for at least neutral damage (Besides the rare Rhyperior). Toxic is a great move on someone as hard to take down as Zapdos, slowly draining the HP of any opposing pokemon, while Roosting off any dammage taken.
Description: Bold nature to take physical assaults better. You might wonder why I give it Max HP, and that's too get maximum leftovers recovery, and because I don't fear Stealth Rock that much. 32 Speed to outspeed certain pokemon, and the rest into Def to take physical attacks better.

So that's the team. I know there are some pokemon that greatly threaten this team, mainly Scizor (On the grass types), Staraptor, Starmie and Mamoswine. A pokemon I had in mind of putting in was a scarf starmie over zapdos, resisting fire types as well as revenge killing all of the above (Including scizor because I would run HP fire). I WILL DELETE THIS THREAD AFTER I FEEL LIKE I HAVE CREATED A GOOD TEAM SO NO ONE CHALLENGING MY LEAGUE CAN SEE MY TEAM. Anyways, plz tell me whatcha think; ANY advice would be greatly appreciated.
A Final Look...
 

ZapdosBlitz

Hi bro!
So this league is what makes you leaving shoddy for awhile?Anyway onto the rate

You really concern about zapdos role that is a bit limited in this team right?Yes I must say Zapdos is a bit dead weight on a team like this and I recommend you replacing Zapdos to Swampert for these reason:
-Swampert only have grass weakness that is pretty much covered by all the rest of the team members
-Zapdos add more of ice weakness when swampert has neutrality to it
-Swampert also resist bug and steel like zapdos when it's also giving resistance to rock while zapdos is weak to it
-Swampert also a great checks to Scizor because of it's huge defence and resistance to bullet punch and u-turn,Mamoswine thanks to STAB surf and neutrality to ice,Staraptor because it's naturally high defence,and don't mind facing starmie because it have immunity to electric except if it's carrying grass knot
With that in mind I recommend Swampert with this set


Swampert @Leftovers
Ability :Torrent
252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Nature :Relaxed
-Surf /Hydro Pump
-Earthquake
-Ice Beam
-Roar

This is MixPert with the exception of no SR here,Ice Beam always OHKO Mence (MixMence is a big threat to this team) while Earthquake and Surf is two reliable STAB moves,the choice between Surf and Hydro Pump is up to you,Hydro Pump boast an OHKO on Mamoswine and 2HKO on SDScizor while Surf provide perfect accuracy.Roar is there because your team lack phazer and having 1 to fill this role wouldn't hurt

This is all for now and good luck with the team :)
 
Airfoil

Airfoil

Breloom is an excellent choice. I am constantly getting destroyed by them. I think you should put more speed on breloom. Swapping the 252 onto speed instead of attack would help to outrun several Pokemon that would normally out pace you, such as Jolly Scizor (almost never seen) and Agiligross. It can also help w/ DDtar, but it probably won't stay in long enough to be spored or anything and is usually handled by Mach Punch if it stays. As you said yourself, Breloom has loads of power on his own, and your still leaving him w/ plenty of attack.

That, and you should put Sub somewhere Breloom. You don't have to, I'm just saying it protects you from a hit after the Pokemon wakes up and gives you a chance to Spore them again. You also don't want the Pokemon to wake up and attack you while you are in the middle of a focus Punch. I would say get rid of Mach Punch, but it's your choice.


I agree with D-Pulse on Heatran. Not only is Explosion not too necessary on a team like this, but Heatran covers a lot of the team's weaknesses, and the last thing you need is to give something like Weavile and opening. Heatran is too valuable defensively to sacrifice itself.
 

Ich777ich

@Zapdosblitz- That's a good idea, but I'll have to try it out first before I make it final. However, unlike Zapdos, Swampert does not have a reliable recovery move like Roost to help it take attacks better. But it does cover a lot of the threats to my team, I'l probably run hydro pump to get those crucial 2HKO's and OHKO's. And one small thing, Swampert does not resist U-turn.

@Rein- Thanks for the rate on my team, especially on Breloom lol. I'll definitely run max speed on it, I just ran with the smogon set (Idk why they recommend only 208 Speed). However, I'll probably stick with Mach Punch on Breloom because it gives my team Priority for killing off frail faster pokemon. Dragon Pulse is what I think I'll go with on Heatran because it doesn't really fit my team. However, you brought up a good point about how Heatran is very important defensively to my team, which made me think I should run a Defensive Heatran set. Any suggestions?
 
Airfoil

Airfoil

I was thinking about a defensive set also as I was typing that. I can't think of anything right now, but Will-O-Wisp/Lava Plume would probably work good on a defensive set. Burning the opponent and cutting it's attack can also help the rest of the team, especially Zapdos, weakening most physical rock attacks coming his way. It's also nice that Heatran is Immune to almost every type of passive damage like Toxic Spikes, Burn and Poison.
*Keep in mind Will-0-Wisps foul accuracy, though.*

Rest Talk, Tormentran, and the Sub sets would probably work nice. I come up with a set and let you know.

Mach Punch probably would work best, as you said, to stop weaker priority users. Especially Weavile. Heatran/Breloom cover it, but if it but neither will enjoy Brick Break/Ice Punch. You'll have to be really careful around it. I just thought Sub was something to consider, all the same.
 

Ich777ich

Yeah, I agree with you on a good defensive set. If you ever think of a good one for my team please let me know, because Heatran's typing is very important to my team defensively. Burn support definitely helps my team because other than Zapdos my team hates physical attacks. My team's biggest weakness is probably ice types, like Weavile and Mamoswine, especially mamoswine because it's ice shard is annoying. Plus it outpaces Heatran. Unfortunately for my team, Scizor is not the best teammate because it just adds another fire weakness.
 

pokemon

Frik yes! Scarfed Rest for the win! xD lol, so now thats out of the way heres mah rate. I can see DD- Mence ripping through this team after a DD. It outspeeds Roserade, and OHKOs with Fire Blast. Earthquake OHKOs Heatran, Outrage can OHKO Zapdos IIRC. Outrage can OHKO Torterra and Celebi. Outrage also OHKOs Breloom. No grass besides Scarf Celebi(which can only outspeed if your lucky) and Scarf-Sceptile can outspeed and OHKO Mence after 1 DD. Thats why I recommend switching Roserade to a lead set, but not use it as a lead. Bring it in after Celebi to get up some Toxic Spikes. Usually after the lead, no offensive poke carries Taunt, bar Bulky Gyara IIRC. So you're safe to set up TS and cripple every poke that is affected. Plus it can also take a few pokes with it. Sleep Powder is for the obvious sleep. I would switch Heatran to a Scarf pokemon that can deal with Salamence and Scizor. I would suggest a Jirachi as it has good stats all around.
 
Airfoil

Airfoil

Yes, but if you get rid of Heatran than what about all the Infernapes, Weaviles, and Heatran that will show up? Putting some defense into Torterra would help cushion Outrage, RP, then SE, to finish him. I don't know a set offhand...but...It might work.

Still working on that Heatran....I'll have later on today.
 

Farewell

Ludicolo removes a Fire weakness, covers Heatran very well, and has great coverage. Also, even though you use Fire moves, consider using it as a Rain Dance sweeper.

It would outpace fast threats like Weavile, deals loads of damage with Hydro Pump, and allow for 1 less Ice weak grass type. Additionally, in the Rain Roserade can abuse weather ball on Fire types (like Heatran or Infernape).

Rain benefits your team by eliminating the Fire weakness on your other grass types, allowing you to take Fire hits without relying on Heatran.

Additionally, if you use Ludicolo and Rain Dance, it would open the door to help both Zapdos and Swampert, depending on which 1 you want to use, allowing for Thunder over Thunderbolt, or Hydro Pump over Surf on Swampert. Yes Heatwave would be nerfed, but Hidden Power could replace it.

Even better, you could add a 2nd Swift Swimmer like Kingdra, which is not only great at taking Fire, and Water Attacks, but has Great coverage using either a Dragon Dance or Specially Mixed set.

Roserade again would get Weather Ball working for it. Roserade could probably then use a more supportive set, say a Toxic Spikes set, since it wont need Scarf to outpace threats, as Ludicolo and/or Kingdra could be your sweepers.
 

ZapdosBlitz

Yeah sorry for the Swampert I was only want to say bullet punch lol :P
Rest is the way to go on Roserade because you already have Breloom as a sleep inducer and 2 sleeper is a bit too much,btw because DDmence is a problem you should run timid nature on Roserade so you can outspeed +1 mence in the hope that it have naughty nature :P.
You must run Stone Edge over Seed Bomb on Breloom because after one of opponent member is spored,they will bring thing such as Gyara and Mence that have intimidate and hit by Focus Punch for NVE damage,SE hit those two for SE damage(SE for SE?lol) and keep that Mach Punch because it is really useful
 

Ich777ich

That's a good idea Zapdosblitz, i mean, it's not like I need another grass move on this team, I have other grass pokemon lol. Thanks for that idea, so it'd be Spore, Stone edge, Mach Punch, and Focus Punch?

Now for the other suggestions... (Thanks for all the great ideas ya'll!)

@pokemon- Yeah DD salamence is a big problem for this team. I'll think I'll run a Timid nature on Roserade for dealing with it because it can outspeed it after +1 if Salamence runs a Naughty Nature (Since almost all DD Sal run that nature). One more thing, Idk if you liked or disliked the rest on a scarfer lol. It does pretty well, especially when I know my opponent will switch out and I'm low on health. Also, Heatran is almost necessary on a Grass mono team because it covers all of the weaknesses of a Grass type pokemon. Unless I choose to run a RD team (It's a good idea), I'll keep heatran for sure. The idea for the roserade set is good, i'll be sure to try it out. Since Lead Roserade are sooo predictable, running it later on my team to get a safe switch-in is a lot more effective way of using it (Reminds me of how some people save froslass for midgame in UU to have a more safe way of setting up spikes).

@hhjj- That is a really good idea for a Mono Grass team, running a RD team. Ludicolo was one choice I had in mind for an alternative grass type on my team, but couldn't do much on a standard team without Rain Support. I could run a SD Kabutops set with SD, AJ, Waterfall, and Stone Edge. Kingdra is a great mixed sweeper in the rain, but I want to keep Zapdos with Thunder and all that good stuff, along with offering some good resistances for the team. I really the idea of a RD Grass team, but could you give me some ideas with what to do with my other pokemon?

Thanks again for the help everyone, I'll update my team now.
 

pokemon

actually nowadays Smogon has become smart and has advised people to run, Naive, Max Speed. So you'll never outspeed it with Scarf-Rade after 1 DD.
 

Farewell

Kingdra over Heatran... Rain cuts out need for Fire resist as it helps your entire team, Kingdra's 4x resist is close enough to an immunity, and it becomes 8x when under Rain.

Kingdra: @ Life Orb
252 Atk / 24 SpA / 232 Spe
Naughty

Dragon Dance
Waterfall
Outrage
Hydro Pump

I like Kingdra because it is able to sweep with or without Rain Dance as it packs Dragon Dance. I chose Hydro Pump over Draco Meteor because it gets to KO Skarmary with Stealth Rocks support. The given Speed EVs allow Kingdra a stat of 264, enough to outrun base 130 Speed Pokémon after a Dragon Dance. The remaining EVs were placed into maximizing Attack and then into Special Attack. With doubled Speed and boosted Water-type attacks, it will be an absolute terror, then add Dragon Dance.. and yep, this is something for your opponent to be afraid of.

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KEEP AS LEAD- I JUST THOUGHT KINGDRA WAS THE MOST IMPORTANT CHANGE. Rain Dance in general allows you to remove Occa berry on Celebi, and give it Leftovers, unless you are facing a Scarf Heatran or Infernape lead. Also, U-turn is nice as if you say send Celebi in against a faster threat while the Rain is going, after a teammate has died, U-turn allows Celebi to take the hit as you switch to say Ludicolo.

Celebi@ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EV's: 76 HP, 252 Sp.A 180 Speed
Nature: Modest
Moveset:
~Stealth Rock
~Leaf Storm
~Earth Power
~U-turn

I thought of making it a Rain Dance set-upper, as it is bulky, and gets U-turn and Recover, but I thought the moveset would be too full with it already using Stealth Rock. Plus, Celebi doesn't get any huge benefits besides reduces its weakness, and using Rain Dance on a lead gives away your strategy. Zapdos, I found, not only benefits with Thunder, but also gets U-turn, and Roost which works just as well if not better.

-----------
Zapdos@ Damp Rock
Ability: Pressure
EV's: 252 HP, 224 Def, 32 Speed
Nature: Bold
Moveset:
~Thunder
~Rain Dance
~U-turn / Hidden Power Ice
~Roost

Zapdos is kept bulky like you initially had it, and supports your team while benefiting from it, not to mention it has a 30% chance to paralyze.
Let's face it, Zapdos will be screwed when facing Ground types, but even with Hidden Power Ice, it isn't investing in Special Attack anyways. Either way with all the Water and Grass attacks, ground types should be more than covered, especially if they are vunerable to Toxic Spikes. Plus, Kingdra should easily outrun Scarf Flygon in the Rain. U-turn works great, allowing it to send in Swift Swimmers pretty easily as Zapdos is just fast enough to outspeed the slower threats, but slow enough to U-turn into the Rain sweepers safely.

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Replace Breloom... with Ludicolo. Less need for priority on Breloom or Scarf on Roserade when you will have Swift Swimmers. Normally I would suggest replacing Roserade instead, but it provides Spikes, also provides Sleep Powder and has Weather Ball...

Ludicolo is amazing as it isn't weak to Fire, and in the Rain it actually resists it. It also has bulk, and good coverage.

Ludicolo (F)
 Life Orb-Modest
 Ability-swift swim
 Evs-252Satk 252Spd 6Dfc
 -Ice Beam
 -Grass Knot
 -Surf
 -Rain Dance

Straight forward, with Rain Dance as an option incase Zapdos dies or Rain runs out. Remember, Rain isn't just used for sweeping, Rain helps the rest of your grass types with their Fire weakness.

------
Roserade: Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
Nature: Calm
252 HP / 136 SpD / 120 Spe
~ Toxic Spikes / Spikes
~ Grass Knot
~ Rest / Weatherball
~ Sleep Powder / Grass Whistle

Toxic Spikes works great with Sleep Powder, but so many things are Immune to it (Poison/Steel, Flying/Levitate), so Spikes may be better, just remember Spikes and Sleep Powder wont work, so just replace Sleep Powder with Grass Whistle in the 4th slot. If you opt for Grass Whistle, you can use Rest over Weatherball to stay alive and come back in. Weatherball will, however, allow Roserade to hit opposing Fire types on their switch in, but it is very dependent on the weather,and since Roserade isn't investing in Special Attack Rest may be better. Keep in mind though, that Weatherball is what seperates it from most Grass types, and under the Rain it may prove useful.

Zapdos supports Roserade by handling Scizor, specifically Choice Band Scizor, as even without Heatwave, Thunder does a number on Scizor while it resists its STAB and Superpower.

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I decided to leave Toterra alone as it provides a Rock resist for Zapdos, and you said it sweeps quite nicely after a Rock Polish, and it prove useful should Rain Dance wear off. My only concern is whether it does anything else for the team? Even if not, that may still be good enough. So let me know.
 

Ich777ich

WOW! That looks like a really cool team, and I can't believe how big of a comment that was lol. Thanks a lot for the time you put into that, it looks like it took a little bit.
Yeah, Kabutops would've been good, but Kingdra functions better on a RD team with it's ability to function as a mixed attacker. Ludicolo makes an amazing RD sweeper as well, don't really need to say anything else besides that. Ground types shouldn't be a problem for this team, but I'd hate for Zapdos to be powerless against ground's. But uturn could let a sweeper come in for free so I think I'll go with uturn. For Roserade, Idk if it should run Rain Dance somewhere on it because just having it on Zapdos (For 8 turns) and Ludicolo (For 5 turns) seems so small. But of course Zapdos is bulky enough to set up the rain again later. Also, why not Leaf Storm over Grass Knot, for a more immediate powerful attack. It's not really meant to do a lot of attacking, but it's good to have that cannon of an attack. I could be wrong. Idk if i should run leftovers on Celebi over Occa Berry for dealing with a fire attack, mostly because I don't really have a good way of dealing with leadape. Any other fire pokemon would get murdered by the RD sweeper son my team. But overall this looks like a really good team. Thanks again for the awesome suggestions, I think I'll have two gym teams for my league, just so then challengers don't plan to take out one the next time or something lol.

One last thing, how much are you selling that colloseum bonus disc for?
 

Ich777ich

Since I have finished getting sufficent information for a grass mono team, any mod please delete this thread now. It's for a gym team and I wanted just to get a little help/get ideas. Please delete though, as I do not want anyone challenging my league to find this team.
 
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