Kung Fu Frog -- UU Hail/Trick Room Team (Peaked #1 / 2022)

KUNG FU FROG
A UU Hail / Trick Room RMT
Peaked @ #1 Pokemon Showdown ladder / 2022 ACRE



(Sorry -- I almost forgot this : P)

Hello everyone! This is my first post on Smogon, first RMT and one of my first attempts at competitive UU battling.

The overall goal of this team is rather simple; take avantage of Abomasnow's Snow Warning let my team 100% accurate Blizzards to eliminate the opposition. It has a few other tricks (including a really cool set which I started to use after reading the Quantum of Solosis RMT in the Archive); the real point is to create a win condition by setting up Trick Room and allowing Glaceon to come in and sweep.

I had decent success with this team, reaching the #1 spot on the UU ladder and hitting a top of 2022 ACRE under the name "Kung Fu Frog." I am rather surprised that I had any success with this team as I’m sure it has a bunch of problems, and I'm still very new to UU / just restarted competitive battling a few weeks ago after a long break, so any and all help is appreciated!


This is the team --


A couple of notes about the team's overall problems before I go more in depth. The basic problems I've encountered are as follows: (1) lack of a dedicated physical attacker leaves me super reliant on Solosis and Abomasnow to dispatch Specially Defensive behemoths such as Snorlax. (2) lack of reliable switch-ins to a litany of offensive threats. This team almost always suffers 2 or 3 casualties at least in a given match, simply because I barely have a way to wall some of the strongest Pokemon in the tier. A perfect example is Choice Scarf Heracross -- if it switches in on anything other than Jynx when Trick Room is not set up, something of mine is going to die. (3) The indescribable fear of rain teams which is brought on by using this team leads to crazy over predictions and idiotic plays. If a team has a Tornadus, Kingdra or even Blastoise on it, I no longer feel comfortable with playing Abomasnow as aggressively as I usually do. Though I've managed to limit this to an extent by ensuring that the team is able to continue to function (and flourish, in a weird way) in the rain, every so often I still get into troublesome situations.

Now, here's all the specifics and whatnot --




DaBeryGudWan (Abomasnow) @ Focus Sash
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 Atk / 172 SAtk / 84 Spd
Lonely Nature
- Wood Hammer
- Ice Shard
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Earthquake

Abomasnow is on the team for obvious reasons – the easiest way to abuse 100% accurate Blizzards is by using its Snow Warning ability. In 90% of the matches I’ve had, the other team has not been another weather team, which is why the set I’m using isn’t built to be very sustainable. Abomasnow has a surprisingly large amount of coverage – Ice Shard hits Togekiss, Yanmega, and finishes off weakened enemies, HP Fire kills Steel types, and EQ is a useful all-purpose move which also hits hard against fire-types like Victini and Darmanitan (though a smart opponent would go for U-Turn instead of V-Create / Flare Blitz on the first turn), and to a lesser extent Arcanine.

Abomasnow is able to hit surprisingly hard, especially with STAB Wood Hammer, which can put a dent in almost everything – it’s especially useful for heavily damaging Snorlax, which is often easily able to wall my entire team otherwise. Given that Abomasnow isn’t going to outspeed most of the above threats, I felt that a Focus Sash would be the most useful item to ensure that Abomasnow can do as much damage as possible.




2chainz (Solosis) @ Focus Sash
Trait: Magic Guard
Level: 1
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Trick Room
- Endeavor
- Toxic
- Confuse Ray

All credit goes to ShakeItUp for this set -- it's the exact same as the one used in the Quantum of Solosis RMT and it does its job fantastically. Magic Guard ensures that Solosis' Focus Sash remains intact, allowing it to shrug off most status and all entry hazards. As Solosis sets up Trick Room, most opponents bring it down to its Focus Sash (which is easily doable given Solosis is at Level 1) with any attack. This gives it an extremely easy way to take down another Pokemon with it so long as the opponent doesn't have priority, and also creates a perfect set up for Glaceon to sweep by giving it 3 free turns of Trick Room. Many times, the opponent doesn't even bring Solosis down to its Sash, instead choosing to switch -- this allows for it to net multiple kills, as at 1 HP a Solosis with full health still brings opposing Pokemon down into the KO zone for hail.

The other 2 moves are largely filler; Toxic lets it cripple opponents which Hail can't effect, and Confuse Ray can deal with the odd Clefable. I can't count the number of people I've had yell at me for using such a "gimmicky" set, but it does its job consistently and reliably.

2chainz, 2strong.




Hi Thar (Jynx) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Blizzard
- Energy Ball
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball

The fastest part of the team, Jynx functions as a sort of "glue" for the team which is able to keep things together while Trick Room isn't up. Jynx is able to counter multiple threats which otherwise pose large threats to this team, including Heracross, Chandelure, Froslass and CroCune. With a Timid Nature, Jynx can outspeed Heracross and KO it (with Psychic most of the time, but Blizzard can net a KO if Hera's at -1). Jynx can come in on Frosslass's Taunt / Spikes and dispatch it with Shadow Ball before it can do its stupid Destiny Bond shenanigans, and can revenge-kill Chandelure. CroCune can literally do nothing to Jynx due to its Dry Skin ability, which absorbs all Water-type attacks. Energy Ball can KO Swampert and weakened Rhyperior, as well as bulky waters like Milotic and Slowbro; Blizzard is a reliable STAB and is useful for outside of Trick Room, where Jynx can make quick work of Pokemon like Kingdra and Yanmega (so long as they're not already at +2 speed or higher).

As mentioned above, Dry Skin is one of the reasons why Jynx is so useful for this team; it's one of the reasons why losing the weather war doesn't spell the end for the team. Not only does Jynx benefit from the rain through replenished health, but it also throws a wrench into the opponent's strategy by depriving them of their precious boosted STAB moves. Sure, coverage moves exist and can still be used, but the lack of perma-rain means that Jynx and Empoleon can always wait out the storm and revenge-kill their now unboosted Swift Swimmers.



Lolwut (Empoleon) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Torrent
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Quiet Nature
- Surf
- Blizzard
- Grass Knot
- Hidden Power [Ground]

Choice Specs Empoleon is just so much fun!! I can't describe how great it feels to have someone switch in something like Hitmontop predicting you to be a Defensive SR set or something, then getting totally wrecked by a STAB Surf coming off of a Base 111 Special Attack stat. Unlike Glaceon, Empoleon's very well rounded stats and unique defensive typing allows it to function outside of Trick Room as a wallbreaker / tank of sorts. I decided to forego the raw power of Hydropump for Surf, as 85% accuracy is not something to mess with (especially since I, like many others, tend to view myself as the unluckiest person ever to go on the Pokemon Showdown server). Blizzard, Surf and Grass Knot alone give Empoleon perfect coverage; Hidden Power Ground is really just a filler move for hitting the rare Electric-type.

Like Jynx, Empoleon too functions as an essential "glue" of the team; it can function both in Trick Room and out, and its strongest move is BOOSTED in the Rain, making it even more dangerous under Trick Room as a sweeper. If I'm unable to keep Abomasnow alive long enough to prevent Rain Dance from going up, Empoleon under Trick Room is able to outspeed and resist the STABs of many Swift Swim Pokemon (notably, it resists Kingdra's dual STAB) and retaliate with its own Rain-boosted attacks, becoming a dangerous sweeper in its own.



Breadcrumbs (Porygon2) @ Eviolite
Trait: Trace
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Trick Room
- Thunderbolt
- Blizzard
- Recover


Oh, Porygon2, thou art a lifesaver. Were it not for this... duck (I think it's a duck? I dunno tbh), Chandelure would have swept me more times than I can count. Alas, Trace is the coolest ability ever, and renders me immune to the dual STAB of this haunted chandelier, forcing it out or letting me put it to an end with Thunderbolt. Arguably more important than this key role in my team, however, is Porygon2's ability to repeatedly and reliably set up Trick Room. Solosis's one time set-up, while entertaining and effective, only works once -- Porygon2's great natural bulk combined with Eviolite lets it survive some of the strongest of attacks (e.g., Scarf Darmanitan's Flare Blitz), set up Trick Room, and heal right back up or retaliate.

A note on the moves chosen for this set -- while obviously Tri Attack is a great move which sucks to be missing out on, I concluded that Blizzard and Thunderbolt can be put to better use. The only KOs I was really forfeiting without Tri Attack were Kingdra and Rotom-H, and those could be dealt with separately by Glaceon and Empoleon respectively (or even Jynx outside of Trick Room). Furthermore, this Porygon2 is intended to play a supporting role rather than a sweeping role; Recover is necessary to ensure that Porygon2 can live to set up another Trick Room, as 4 turns is seldom enough time to completely sweep an opponent's team.



Bruce (Glaceon) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Ice Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Blizzard
- Ice Beam
- Signal Beam
- Shadow Ball

Without question, the star of the team. Glaceon is just begging to be used on a Hail + Trick Room team -- STAB Blizzard, an enormous Base 130 Special Attack, abysmal speed and surprisingly decent bulk all come together to create a total monster under the Hail and a nearly unstoppable force under Hail and Trick Room.

Blizzard is obviously the main move of this set. As stated above, it can simply annihilate unprepared teams, and the abundance of Flying and Ground-types makes it all the more powerful. Ice Beam is for instances when Hail isn't up -- regardless of the drop in Base Power, it still gets STAB and is coming off of a Base 130 Special Attack stat with Choice Specs, so it's still sure to put a dent in the enemy Pokemon. Shadow Ball and Signal Beam are filler; they're used to hit Ghost and Psychic types respectively.


While this team has been super successful, there are several Pokemon which can make battles extremely hard to win. Rhyperior outspeeds both of my sweepers under Trick Room and can destroy them with Earthquake and Rock Blast. Not only that, but it can also prevent Solosis from setting up Trick Room with Rock Blast! It can both abuse and prevent me from setting up Trick Room. Another large problem is Snorlax -- it's a specially defensive monster which can wall the vast majority of my team. While Abomasnow's Wood Hammer takes off about 1/2 of its health, its Thick Fat ability severely lessens the impact of Blizzard, forcing me to rely on either Solosis or Empoleon to damage it. I remember that, on one occasion, I was 6-0ed by a RestTalking Snorlax simply because I was unable to dent it at all after Abomasnow died and it healed up!

So, that's my team! Through a lot of work and testing, I was eventually able to reach the top of the ladder (if only for short periods of time; Living Proof was quick to rebound on both occasions), which I'm super happy about, but clearly a lot of problems remain to be fixed and the team can still be developed more. As I said above, any and all suggestions will be much appreciated, and I'll definitely take them into account while trying to make this team even better! Thanks much!
 
THREAT LIST
(to be filled out asap)

UU Offensive Threats

Aerodactyl:
  • Life Orb
Ambipom:
  • All-Out Attacker
Arcanine:
  • Offensive
Azelf:
  • Nasty Plot
  • All-Out Attacker
  • Dual Screens
  • Choice Band
Azumarill:
  • Choice Band
Bisharp:
  • Swords Dance
Chandelure:
  • Substitute
  • Choice Scarf
  • Choice Specs
Cinccino:
  • All-Out Attacker
Cobalion:
  • Swords Dance
  • Calm Mind
  • Utility
Cofagrigus:
  • Nasty Plot + Trick Room
Crobat:
  • Stallbreaker
  • Choice Band
Darmanitan:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Life Orb
Durant:
  • Hone Claws
  • Choice Band
Eelektross:
  • Special Attacker
  • Coil
Empoleon:
  • SubPetaya
  • Choice Specs
  • Agility
Escavalier:
  • Choice Band
  • Specially Defensive
Flygon:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Choice Band
  • Mixed Attacker
Froslass:
  • Utility
Gallade:
  • Swords Dance
  • Choice Band
  • Choice Scarf
  • Bulk Up
Galvantula:
  • Special Attacker
Golurk:
  • Tank
Gorebyss:
  • Baton Pass
Heracross:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Swords Dance
  • Choice Band
Honchkrow:
  • Life Orb
  • Choice Scarf
Houndoom:
  • Mixed Attacker
  • Nasty Plot
Kingdra:
  • Substitute + Dragon Dance
  • Rain Dance
  • Offensive Dragon Dance
  • Choice Specs
  • ChestoRest
Krookodile:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Bulk Up
  • Choice Band
Lilligant:
  • Quiver Dance
Machamp:
  • Subchamp
  • Bulk Up
Meloetta:
  • Substitute + Calm Mind
  • Offensive Calm Mind
Mew:
  • Nasty Plot
  • Swords Dance
  • Support
  • Baton Pass
Mienshao
  • All-Out Attacker
  • Substitute + Baton Pass
  • Choice Scarf
  • Swords Dance
Mismagius:
  • Nasty Plot
Nidoking:
  • Life Orb
  • Choice Scarf
Ninjask:
  • Baton Pass
Omastar:
  • Shell Smash
Porygon-Z:
  • Agility
  • Nasty Plot
  • Choice Specs
  • Choice Scarf
Raikou:
  • Substitute + Calm Mind
  • Life Orb
  • Choice Scarf
  • Choice Specs
Rhyperior:
  • Tank
  • Choice Band
  • Rock Polish
Roserade:
  • Offensive
Rotom-C:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Choice Specs
  • Utility
Rotom-H:
  • Choice Scarf
  • Choice Specs
Sceptile:
  • Swords Dance
  • Special Attacker
Scolipede:
  • Spikes
  • Swords Dance
Scrafty:
  • Bulk Up
  • Dragon Dance
Sharpedo:
  • Physical Attacker
  • Mixed Attacker
Shaymin:
  • Life Orb
Sigilyph:
  • Boosting Sweeper
Smeargle:
  • Hazards Settler
  • Baton Pass
Snorlax:
  • Choice Band
  • Curse
Suicune:
  • Offensive
  • CroCune
Togekiss:
  • Defensive Nasty Plot
  • Offensive Nasty Plot
  • ParaFlinch
  • Choice Scarf
Tornadus:
  • Rain Dance
  • Bulk Up
Venomoth:
  • Baton Pass
  • Offensive Quiver Dance
Victini:
  • Choice Band
  • Choice Scarf
  • Mixed Attacker
Virizion
  • Calm Mind
  • Swords Dance
Weavile:
  • Swords Dance
  • All Out Attacker
Yanmega:
  • Choice Specs
  • Speed Boost
Zapdos:
  • Life Orb
  • Choice Specs
  • SubRoost
Zoroark:
  • Choice Specs
  • Nasty Plot
  • All Out Attacker

UU Defensive Threats


Blastoise:
  • Utility
Bronzong:
  • Tank
  • Dual Screens
  • Calm Mind
Claydol:
  • Support
Clefable:
  • Support
  • Life Orb
Cresselia:
  • Defensive
  • Dual Screens
  • Substitute + Calm Mind
Cryogonal:
  • Rapid Spin
Dusclops:
  • ResTalk
Empoleon:
  • Specially Defensive
Ferroseed:
  • Spiker
Gligar:
  • Physically Defensive
  • Baton Pass
Hitmontop:
  • Rapid Spin
Milotic:
  • Physically Defensive
  • ResTalk
Nidoqueen:
  • Special Attacker
  • Toxic Spikes
Porygon2:
  • Duck Tank
  • Defensive Duck
  • Trick Room
Quagsire:
  • Curse
  • Physically Defensive
Qwilfish:
  • Utility
Registeel:
  • Tank
Roserade:
  • Spikes
Sableye:
  • Prankster
Slowbro:
  • Support
  • Calm Mind
  • Offensive
Slowking:
  • Physically Defensive
  • Utility Counter
Swampert:
  • Tank
  • Choice Band
Snorlax:
  • Restalk
Tangrowth:
  • Tank
  • Chlorophyll Sweeper
Umbreon:
  • Wish Support
Uxie:
  • Dual Screens
  • Support
  • Substitute + Calm Mind
Whimsicott:
  • Prankster
Xatu:
  • Support
 

Shuckleking87

"Assault vest makes everything better" AV Seaking, BT
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
I am not sure how Choice scarfed Mienshao has not utterly destroyed this team yet...
 
Yea I'd like to see some replays for this team, just to see how it handles Fire and Fighting types. Congrats on the peak though.
 
I am not sure how Choice scarfed Mienshao has not utterly destroyed this team yet...
Oh wow yea, how did I fail to mention that o__O I have very limited ways of dealing with Scarf Mienshao and it does do a huge amount of damage to my team. The way I've dealt with it so far is... really just to keep TR up as much as possible -- Porygon2 can live an HJK from Scarf Mienshao iirc which ensures I can set up TR and force it out / KO it. Solosis can similarly take a hit with Focus Sash and set up TR.

But you're right, Scarf Mienshao is very threatening to my team. ]: I guess I've also been lucky in that I've seen the LO variant more often. Any suggestions as to what to change?

Yea I'd like to see some replays for this team, just to see how it handles Fire and Fighting types. Congrats on the peak though.
Thanks much! [: I'd be happy to post some replays ASAP, don't have any atm but can easily have more battles.
 

KM

slayification
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
As someone who's used Porygon2 successfully on a hail team in UU. (Rank 10 before the reset :( ), I'd suggest using Magic Coat. If you lead with P2, you can actually get up some hazards, which your team lacks, and also prevent some hazards. (People seem to not realize that they can just keep spamming their hazards until you don't magic coat.) That said, it would be very helpful for your Trick Room sweepers to have that extra little bit of Spikes/SR damage. In terms of what move to replace, I'd suggest perhaps Blizzard? It is nice to have a base 120 move, but you already have a lot of BlizzSpam on this team, and I feel like its more novelty than anything else. You could also replace Tbolt with Discharge and Trick Room with Magic Coat to make it less of a trick room team, but that's more of an overall team change.

I'm not really in love with the Abomasnow out of everything. Sash seems gimmicky at best, and when you combine it with Wood Hammer it just seems pretty bad. I personally find an offensive seeder set to be useful, but your hail team is pretty unconventional.

The solosis is lovely.

Jynx seems not very important. You already have a strong rain counter in Empoleon, and rain teams aren't really common enough to warrant two counters to them on a hail team which could benefit from many other things. You could either replace it with another scarfer (Rotom-F), or put in a Qwil for more hazards and for a defensive wall to help deal with Fire/Fighting pokes.

Just some thoughts, I love the team overall and the way it revolutionizes the standard idea of a hail team. Congrats on the peak.
 
But you're right, Scarf Mienshao is very threatening to my team. ]: I guess I've also been lucky in that I've seen the LO variant more often. Any suggestions as to what to change?
I'm surprised that you aren't facing too many Scarf Mienshaos, especially since you're actually high in the ladder. To be honest, unless it was dumb luck that got you that high in the ladder then you shouldn't change any pokemon around. I do think that an OTR Cofagrigus would really help patch up the Fighting weakness this team has however.

Your suicidal attitude towards Abomasnow (it having a Sash and all) could really be a problem if it dies and the other team has a Rain Dance (or Sunny Day...) user. With the Hail gone the team is in a bad situation as it's main strategy is Blizzard spam, just something you need to keep in mind whenever facing a Kingdra or Tornadus.

I don't understand the reasoning behind HP Fire on Abomasnow, it would only really be used for Bronzong, which is a waste of time (172 SpA Abomasnow Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Bronzong: 100-118 (29.58 - 34.91%) -- possible 4HKO). I think those SAtk EVs would be better placed in HP or Speed.
 
As someone who's used Porygon2 successfully on a hail team in UU. (Rank 10 before the reset :( ), I'd suggest using Magic Coat. If you lead with P2, you can actually get up some hazards, which your team lacks, and also prevent some hazards. (People seem to not realize that they can just keep spamming their hazards until you don't magic coat.) That said, it would be very helpful for your Trick Room sweepers to have that extra little bit of Spikes/SR damage. In terms of what move to replace, I'd suggest perhaps Blizzard? It is nice to have a base 120 move, but you already have a lot of BlizzSpam on this team, and I feel like its more novelty than anything else. You could also replace Tbolt with Discharge and Trick Room with Magic Coat to make it less of a trick room team, but that's more of an overall team change.
This makes quite a bit of sense to me (: Given that I've been using Porygon2 less as a TR sweeper and more as a way of reliably setting up TR, maybe it'd be better to transition to something like the "Defensive Duck" set on the site? I could run something like Trick Room / Thunderbolt / Magic Coat / Recover. Discharge + TR seems not to be a great idea because I don't want to be outsped under Trick Room, but Magic Coat definitely seems smart.

I'm not really in love with the Abomasnow out of everything. Sash seems gimmicky at best, and when you combine it with Wood Hammer it just seems pretty bad. I personally find an offensive seeder set to be useful, but your hail team is pretty unconventional.
Yea, I agree that the Abomasnow set isn't all too great -- it used to be Expert Belted, but it just died so often ]: The sash has almost turned Abomasnow into a dedicated lead which is kinda annoying as it makes the team super predictable. An offensive seeder set sounds really interesting -- is there a set online for it?

EDIT: If I were to replace Wood Hammer with Seed Bomb, do you think that continuing to use it as a Focus Sash lead would be viable? It's surprising how many people just try to go straight for the kill with Victini / Darmanitan / Mienshao and end up getting KOed by EQ + Ice Shard, or Wood Hammer. And seeing as my team's so weak to those pokes, getting rid of them early is a big help :P

The solosis is lovely.
(:

Jynx seems not very important. You already have a strong rain counter in Empoleon, and rain teams aren't really common enough to warrant two counters to them on a hail team which could benefit from many other things. You could either replace it with another scarfer (Rotom-F), or put in a Qwil for more hazards and for a defensive wall to help deal with Fire/Fighting pokes.
I'll definitely try replacing Jynx with Rotom-F -- idk why I haven't tried it yet tbh. : P Thanks.

The reason I feel like replacing Jynx with Qwilfish wouldn't work is cuz I'd lose the ability to deal with some boosting sweepers like Kingdra and Yanmega. Yanmega especially, since Intimidate doesn't impact its ability to sweep. In both situations, at Jynx is able to outspeed them at +1 and KO (for Kingdra it's not an OHKO but it's like 70%ish) with Blizzard.

As for Rotom-F -- given its horrible defensive typing and my team's already huge weakness to Fire/Fighting, I don't know if it's worth sacrificing Jynx's extra speed and higher Special attack stat for Rotom-F's increased bulk. Though an EQ immunity is nice, if i recall correctly Rotom-F is unable to outspeed Kingdra / Yanmega at +1 (which also leads to problems with things like, say, Sharpedo) and also can't outspeed some dangerous Scarfers like Porygon-Z and Krookodile

EDIT: How could I forget??? If Scarf Hera isn't at -1 SpDef from Close Combat, Rotom-F can't OHKO it with Blizzard (it does like 70% from Jynx). Jynx however gets Psychic which can easily one-shot the bug.

Just some thoughts, I love the team overall and the way it revolutionizes the standard idea of a hail team. Congrats on the peak.
Thanks so much! I'll be sure to make the changes and try them out tomorrow. [:

I'm surprised that you aren't facing too many Scarf Mienshaos, especially since you're actually high in the ladder. To be honest, unless it was dumb luck that got you that high in the ladder then you shouldn't change any pokemon around.
It was probably a bit of dumb luck. :P My win-loss was 70-11 or something, so it's not like I played very much.

I do think that an OTR Cofagrigus would really help patch up the Fighting weakness this team has however.
This seems like a great idea! Do you think I could replace Jynx with an OTR Cofagrigus? That'd remedy my issues with Scarf Hera, Scarf Mienshao, and possibly even stuff like Darmanitan (which Jynx speed ties with so can't really handle right now).

Your suicidal attitude towards Abomasnow (it having a Sash and all) could really be a problem if it dies and the other team has a Rain Dance (or Sunny Day...) user. With the Hail gone the team is in a bad situation as it's main strategy is Blizzard spam, just something you need to keep in mind whenever facing a Kingdra or Tornadus.
Yea, like I said in the first post, whenever I see a Kingdra or Tornadus in the Team Preview I start to play horribly defensively and often just throw the game xP I think this could be solved by switching to a more sustainable Abomasnow set like suggested above.

I don't understand the reasoning behind HP Fire on Abomasnow, it would only really be used for Bronzong, which is a waste of time (172 SpA Abomasnow Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Bronzong: 100-118 (29.58 - 34.91%) -- possible 4HKO). I think those SAtk EVs would be better placed in HP or Speed.
I agree once again :P Empoleon's Surf does more and can reliably take out Bronzong without me having to sacrifice Abomasnow to Gyroball (but I guess EQ is something to watch out for ]:). Do you think I should change Abomasnow's set entirely to something like a Subseeder? My other idea was to give it an Expert Belt, which would score it a 2HKO against Bronzong with HP Fire (Bronzong can't OHKO with Gyroball anyways, it does like 75%) as well as significantly buff its Ice Shard against stuff like Zapdos which comes in to kill with Heat Wave.

Thanks for the rate! (:
 
UPDATE: So I figured out an interesting set to resolve a lot of the problems on this team, namely (1) weakness to Fighting Types , (2) Lack of entry hazards , (3) Being totally walled by Snorlax and the like on multiple occasions -- while still keeping much of the team intact.

I've replaced Jynx with a Choice Scarf Froslass.

Hi Thar (Froslass) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Cursed Body
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Modest Nature
- Blizzard
- Psychic
- Trick
- Spikes

This set outspeeds Choice Scarf Heracross and OHKOs with Psychic. Mienshao is not a problem for the team because being locked into HJK ensures Froslass can force it out. Froslass also can cripple Pokemon like Snorlax and Bronzong which annoy my team immensely... by Trickscarfing them, then setting up spikes.

Of course, it doesn't hit nearly as hard as Jynx (base 80 special attack leaves much to be desired), but this set's supposed to be a "glue" for the team, not a sweeper.

I've only tested this set a little bit so I can't say I know for sure whether or not it works, but I've had relative success, reaching an ACRE of 2030 (can't claim #1 on this one, though : P)

I've also replaced Focus Sash on Abomasnow with Expert Belt, and am also planning on testing an Offensive Subseed set, a Defensive Porygon2 and Cofagrigus in place of Jynx/Froslass.

Thoughts?
 
I like thiz team alot, im not going to lie. I have a few points that will help clean up your team.
1. Grass knot from max attack empoleon is a guaranteed ohko on rhyperior.
2. As for a physical wall, qwilfish will so wonders with perfect synergy with abomasnow. You could prob drop glaceon since you have a powerful specia attacker in empoleon and jynx. Qwilfish is a great counter to both heracross and mienshao.
3. Focus sash + wood hammer is a big nono. Try choice band abomasnow. Wood hammer is a guaranteed 2hko on 80/0def snorlax. Hp fire isnt needed since a choice specs surf from empoleon will hit harder than a se hp fire on zong. Also qwilfish is a great counter to mono attacking zong with gyro ball.
 
I'm only going to suggest minor changes:

1. On Empoleon, replace HP Ground with Stealth Rock. Your team would surely appreciate the hazards, and HP Ground isn't doing much anyway. Plus it makes opponents think Empoleon is not a Choice Specs variant.
2. Run your remaining 4 EVs on Porygon2 in Defense. You never know, it might help one day.
3. Run a Brave nature on Abomasnow, in order to prevent lowering its bulk, and in the event you bring in Abomasnow during Trick Room's duration.

BTW, Solosis is very annoying. Very nice team overall!
 
I like thiz team alot, im not going to lie. I have a few points that will help clean up your team.
Thanks much for the rate (:

1. Grass knot from max attack empoleon is a guaranteed ohko on rhyperior.
For sure! I've been running Grass Knot, but Rhyperior can still screw me over because most variants outspeed Empoleon under Trick Room and can OHKO me with an Earthquake. ]:

2. As for a physical wall, qwilfish will so wonders with perfect synergy with abomasnow. You could prob drop glaceon since you have a powerful specia attacker in empoleon and jynx. Qwilfish is a great counter to both heracross and mienshao.
Yep! After re-reading this and Kitten Milk's rate, I decided to try out Qwilfish in place of Jynx (Glaceon is necessary to get OHKOs on stuff that Empoleon can't, like Scrafty -- Glaceon can also live a Drain Punch from Scrafty at +1 which Empoleon can't, that extra bulk is useful in unfavorable endgames where I don't keep TR up xP), and it's been working out great at stopping Fighting and Fire type physical attackers. I do have problems with Darmanitan which can carry EQ and be real annoying, though ]:

My one problem is, Spikes are pretty easily spun away and Pain Split isn't the best recovery move, so... Qwilfish isn't really doing much atm xP

3. Focus sash + wood hammer is a big nono. Try choice band abomasnow. Wood hammer is a guaranteed 2hko on 80/0def snorlax. Hp fire isnt needed since a choice specs surf from empoleon will hit harder than a se hp fire on zong. Also qwilfish is a great counter to mono attacking zong with gyro ball.
Yea, sounds good! [: I've been using a bunch of sets for Abomasnow ever since the Wood Hammer / Sash problem has been pointed out, and I'll try a banded one as well.

I'm only going to suggest minor changes:

1. On Empoleon, replace HP Ground with Stealth Rock. Your team would surely appreciate the hazards, and HP Ground isn't doing much anyway. Plus it makes opponents think Empoleon is not a Choice Specs variant.
This is a great idea -- thanks much [:

2. Run your remaining 4 EVs on Porygon2 in Defense. You never know, it might help one day.
How did I miss that? @___@ You're right, thanks xP

3. Run a Brave nature on Abomasnow, in order to prevent lowering its bulk, and in the event you bring in Abomasnow during Trick Room's duration.
Sounds like a plan -- do you think I should just run a bulky Abomasnow set, then? I really have no idea what to do with it tbh ]:

BTW, Solosis is very annoying. Very nice team overall!
It is, isn't it xP Thanks!
 

KM

slayification
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
The offensive seeder set I've had success with -

Abomasnow @ Leftovers
Snow Warning (or effect spore ;))
252 SpA/252 HP/4 Spe - Modest Nature
- Blizzard
- Giga Drain
- Protect
- Leech Seed

The thing's a monster. It hits like a truck and can take a couple of hits too (providing they aren't one of its (7?) weaknesses >.>). Something that might be possible (take note that this is serious theorymon) is to invest the HP EVs into Def/SpD instead so as to maximize the percentage healing from leech seed.

You could also run ScarfSnow. Blizz/Earthquake/Wood Hammer/HP Fire is standard IIRC.
 
An Abomasnow that I've been using recently that I've enjoyed a whole lot:

Abomasnow @ Choice Band
Trait: Snow Warning
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Wood Hammer
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Ice Shard

Wood Hammer is really really powerful, and can deals serious damage even to things that resist it. Having a powerful Ice Shard on the team is always useful as well, as priority can make a big difference near the end of a game. The set could also be configured to sweep under trick room, with 0 Speed IV and a Brave nature, or an all out sweeper with 252 Speed instead of HP.
 
Okay, so after testing out Qwilfish for a while it's been working out fantastically at walling the things that make my team normally fall to pieces (Scarf Mienshao, V-Create Victini, Darmanitan, etc.). However, there's one problem with getting rid of Jynx which I haven't found a way around, and which is really quite unfortunate...

That's Tornadus. Qwilfish provides ample opportunities for it to switch in, and my team is really frail to the point where the Mixed Attacker set totally decimates my team (Superpower takes care of Pory2 and Empoleon). I had thought that Choice Band Abomasnow would remedy this by letting me OHKO with Ice Shard, but unfortunately;

252+ Atk Choice Band Abomasnow Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tornadus: 228-270 (76.25 - 90.3%)

... So that's real unfortunate. ]: Any ideas?

EDIT: To clarify, this wasn't an issue before since Jynx could come in / one-shot with Blizzard and outspeed cuz Scarf, but that's no longer the case as Qwilfish has been really helpful and I'd rather not lose it :P

DOUBLE EDIT: I suppose that Scarf Abomasnow as Kitten Milk suggested, along with a moveset similar to the one suggested by PTJon would solve this problem by outspeeding and KOing with Ice Punch, but that also seems rather situational and not as useful as CB Abomasnow in general /:
 
BUMP / EDIT: So I've basically made the following changes on the team permanently --

Jynx --> Defensive Qwilfish, Spikes/Waterfall/Pain Split/Haze (maybe Toxic instead of Haze is a good idea? idk)

Focus Sash Abomasnow --> CB Abomasnow with the above suggested moveset.

Now, I've been thinking for a bit -- should I replace Specs on Glaceon with Life Orb? I don't know if the loss in attacking power causes Blizzard to miss out on any important KOs (if it does, then I'll keep specs).

However, I do know that Chandy is impeding Glaceon's ability to sweep quite often and forcing me out to Pory2, and it would be really convenient to be able to one-shot it with Shadow Ball if i were allowed to switch moves. :P Thoughts anyone?
 

KM

slayification
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
For Qwilfish, on a more stally team like this I think Toxic Spikes might be your friend in that last Haze moveslot. It'd help Solosis with the sweep as well, given that it makes grounded ice types die after the endeavor turn. Thunder Wave and Taunt are also good options, as well as Explosion for pseudo spin-blocking, but that's only for dedicated stall really :P

I personally like the sheer power of specs Glaceon. Life Orb might be good as well, but I feel like it's one of those pokes where you just spam one move and very rarely deviate from that except for in very special circumstances. I don't know if it loses out on any important KOs, but even if it doesn't on paper it will in practice - perhaps entry hazards and hail will wrack up to the point where you can 1HKO Machamp, or something. Just my opinion though.
 

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