My final GenIV OU team; the Unrelenting Offense

[Random Matt]

EDIT: I'm using itemclause, sorry I assumed this was standard.

Thanks to everyone who gave feedback on the previous threads. I've been testing and trying my team alot since the last thread and this is what I've finally settled with. I'm not going to claim it's unflawed, but no team is without it's share of problems. So this is it, my core team; the Unrelenting Offense.

Aerodactyl
Nickname: Dracuzard
Lead
Pressure
Jolly
Life Orb
HP/Att/Spe
112/252/144
Stealth Rock
Taunt
Earthquake
Crunch
Intended to set up Stealth Rock (essential) and then either weaken the opponent before dying to make an easier finish for the switch-in, or switch out and bite back later. Taunt is a wonderful move of such a fast pokemon to prevent the opponent setting up. Earthquake may not have STAB but it still has decent power and a good coverage aswell as making up for it's absence on the rest of the team. Crunch may seem an odd choice, but it make for a great team-play attack in conjunction with Machamp, OHKO's opposing Gengar (and severly troubles Starmie and Rotom), while the occasional defense drop can help to force switches into SR or get an extra KO.

Weavile
Nickname: Lucifer
Revenge Killer/Attacker
Pressure
Jolly
Expert Belt
HP/Att/Spe
76/252/180 (to outspeed Timid 252 Starmie)
Ice shard
Night Slash
Low Kick
Pursuit
This SE attacker fits in perfectly with the team, dealing with key threats such as Ghosts and Scarfed Flygon, as well as providing an importance back-up Fighting attack should Machamp fall. It deals with basically whatever is weak to its attacks (no shortage of potential victims there), which makes Expert Belt ideal for a good boost without recoil damage or getting stuck on one move.

Starmie
Nickname: Shuriking
Special Attaker/RS Support
Natural Cure
Timid
Wise Specs
HP/SpA/Spe
4/252/252
Surf
Ice Beam
Thunderbolt
Rapid Spin
Yep... I think this one's self-explanatory really. Gives some fast offensive coverage (inculing a back-up Ice attack) and deals with entry hazards. Wise Specs over Life Orb and Choice Specs because I need to be able to switch attacks (especially with that pursuit weakness!) and I can't afford to lose my Rapid Spinner to recoil damage.

Scizor
Nickname: Mars
Problem Puncher
Technician
Adamant
Leftovers
HP/Att/SpD
252/252/4
Bullet Punch
Pursuit
Bug Bite
Counter
Counter is there to turn the tables on physical sweepers, so long as they don't use fire (it will survive +2 maxed-attack Gyarados Waterfall). Bullet Punch because that's what puts Scizor in the tier! Bug Bite delivers a crippling blow to any Dark/Grass/Psychic types, a number of which are bulk enough to need it (such as Umbreon, Cresselia, Tyranitar, Celebi etc). Pursuit to get a few checkmates and general Rotom hating.

Dragonite
Nickname: Jupiter
Dragon Dance Attacker
Inner Focus
Adamant
Yache Berry
HP/Att/Spe
16/252/240 (after one dragon dance will outspeed even Jolly 252 Weavile, and have enough power to 3/4 times OHKO the typical 4HP/0Def Starmie without SR damage)
Dragon Claw
Fire Punch
Extremespeed
Dragon Dance
Intended to come in on a resisted attack and set about either standard attacking, Dragon Dance for some faster and heavier hits, or Extremespeed for a revenge kill/finisher (or just give a quick whack to something sinister). Yache Berry allows it to survive an otherwise leathal Ice attack and get in that all-important Dragon Dance or extra attack needed to come out on top. It was a close call between Fire Punch and Earthquake, but due to all the Levitaing Steels I went with Fire Punch.

Machamp
Nickname: ChuckNoris
Scarfed Attacker
No Guard
Jolly
Choice Scarf
HP/Att/Spe
42/252/216 (to outspeed +Speed natured 252 base 100 speed group)
Dynamicpunch
Stone Edge
Payback
Bullet Punch
This may be surprising, who would waste their precious Choice Scarf on a Machamp? By outspeeding a ship-full of stuff that would never consider the possibility of this happening it can dish out some serious pain and leave unsuspecting opponents lying in a pool of their own confusion and disbelief. Dynamicpunch is obviously the key move, dishing out pain and confusion to anything not ghost type, Stone Edge hits anything else for significant damage with a nice crit chance, Payback is good to hit a predicted ghost switch-in but is only useful once and it helps to be familiar with your opponent. The last slot has alot of options, each having limited and situational use. I chose Bullet Punch for the occasional moments when a really quick smack is needed. Most of the time this will be spaming Dynamicpunch and just spreading pain and confusion around, this is sometimes all it takes.

 

[Random Matt]

hopeful bump...

 

[Braseg257]

hi random, nice team. I suggest you to run stone edge over crunch on aereodactyl, this is for more coverage with edgequake combo. also a super effective crunch is just 10 BP stronger than normal effective stone edge and pokes like gengar are still OHKOed also by SE. the bad point is the lack of accuracy. on machamp I suggest you to run ice punch to kill stuff like salamence and dragons without risk with stone egde. if aereodactyl and machamp are out, magnezone can simply defeat your team, expecially a scarfed-one, with hp fire for weavile and scizor and powerful t-bolt for starmie and dragonite. to fix that you can run brick break/earthquake over fire punch, in this way you get more coverage and lose the OHKO for scizor and forretress but they're not a problem for machamp or even starmie. skarmory seems like a huge threat for this team, except maybe for starmie. for this reason i suggest you to run a mixed Dnite with fire blast over your own set. you can also remove extremespeed if you keep two bullet punch and ice shard for priority. for the rest is a very good team! good luck

 

[Random Matt]

Thanks for that! A correction on Magnezone though; +speed nature, 252 scarfed Magnezone reaches 360 speed. I've got Weavile at 365 so it can lowkick for around 80-85%. Starmie is 361 speed so I can get in a surf to do about 60%, although granted it will lose (unless Magnezone uses some other move predicting a switch). Dragonite is 384 speed after one DD (outspeeding max speed Weavile - not a favorable matchup but still enough to give a very real chance, just over 50% chance to OHKO with the faster priority with SR damage) and will survive Thunderbolt (even having taken SR damage) and hit back with Fire Punch, not getting a OHKO but with a previous DD, coming out the victor (and still making a nasty dent without DD). So with Machamp and Aerodactyl down Magnezone can get a hit in, maybe a KO, but it's far from a game ender.

Stone Edge is definitely nice on Aerodactyl but I gave it alot of consideration and testing and decided that Crunch would be preferable for the accuracy (and the occasional Defense drop is always nice).

Most Scizor will 2HKO both Machamp and Dragonite (I've haven't made calculations here, it just what happens from experience). So I definitely want fire on Dragonite.

Skarmory can be a pain, but it doesn't appriciate Dynamicpunch one bit, or Aerodactyl's taunt. Dragonite can whittle it's HP away with Fire Punch (DD on a predicted Roost). So it's an annoyance but it goes down.

For the priority, best discount Machamp's Bullet Punch since it does not like being locked into a 40 power move, that's only useful in very rare situations. So I think Extremespeed needs to stay.

Something that is buggng me a bit is a case of 4-move-slot sydrome on Scizor, I would really like to have Brick Break on there, but the other moves are all important too... think I'll mix it up a bit and try running Swords Dance over Bug Bite for a bit to see if that works better.

 

[Braseg257]

naa don't replace a STAB like bug bite, if you want use SD is better if you use a set like this:
-bug bite
-bullet punch
-swords dance
-superpower/brick break/pursuit
you have got so much coverage with superpower or brick break and bug bite is extremely important expecially with techinician.

 

[Random Matt]

naa don't replace a STAB like bug bite, if you want use SD is better if you use a set like this:
-bug bite
-bullet punch
-swords dance
-superpower/brick break/pursuit
you have got so much coverage with superpower or brick break and bug bite is extremely important expecially with techinician.

I do really like this set, but I need Counter to stop Gyarados (who can be a problem at times). What would you think of replacing Bullet Punch (on my current set) with Brick Break/Superpower?

Had a bit of a lockdown against a Restalk Gliscor, Metagross, and Chansey earlier when I had Machamp, Scizor, and Starmie (and Stealth Rock on their side of the field). Thinking of switching Machamp's Bullet Punch for Ice Punch (Thunderpunch may seem tempting to deal with the Gyarados problem, but Machamp is all too likely to be KOed before it can attack once Gyarados has started to dance).

 

[2sly4u]

Hi Random Matt. Decent team you've got here.

Your team has some good synergy and offensive prowess, but your item choices are questionable at best. Aerodactyl needs a Focus Sash to get up Rocks against things like Metagross. Starmie should have a Life Orb or Leftovers; Wise Specs don't net any notable KOs for you. I guess that Dragonite's Yache Berry and Weavile's Expert Belt are okay, but I'd think about replacing those with Leftovers and a Choice Band respectively.

As for Machamp, the Choice Scarf lets him outspend a few notable walls, but he's still so slow that most things that threaten him normally are still faster. The only popular pokemon who you could catch by surprise is a Heatran looking to pick you off, but in exchange you make yourself setup bait for many common threats if you get locked in the wrong move; that kind of defeats one of Machamp's main draws, since it's next to impossible to set up on him normally. I recommend you switch him to a normal Lum Berry variant, moving all those Speed EVs into HP. You already have Weavile as a fast and powerful revenge killer, so Scarfing Machamp isn't necessary.

Before I forget, Crunch on Aerodactyl to "help Machamp" is kind of redundant with Weavile, since he can handle any Gengars or Rotoms you encounter.

Good job, and good luck!

 

[Braseg257]

i've done some calcs and +2 scizor's bullet punch can also not-2HKO 4/0 gyarados but +2 bug bite can. I don't know how counter can kill gyarados, but you can easily 2HKO him with bug bite after sords dance, or also switch in starmie and OHKO with thunderbolt. Machamp doesn't need thunderpunch due to the multitude of gyarados with wacan berry and no guard stone edge can easily kill gyara. if gyarados has not set-up machamp can easily win, but a +1 waterfall can OHKO machamp, but with a choice scarf you can outspeed an unboosted gyarados with stone edge but then you need a switch in due to your only attack is SE. a pokemon that can easily OHKO both blissey, metagross and gliscor is a mixed infernape with this set:
-fire blast
-close combact
-hp ice
-grass knot/vacuum wave/thunderpunch
it can easily destroy that mons, and with some attack investment can kill gyarados with thunderpunch if he hasn't got any boost. also blaziken can kill these 4 if gliscor and gyarados doesn't have max speed and generally a rest/talker doesn't ave max speed and i saw on shoddy my blaziken outspeeded lots of gyarados because they run a bulkier set, and generally thunderpunch/stone edge killed them. unlukily for macham is not good to be locked in a move, I suggest to give him less speed and more bulk to surely survive a +0 waterfall by gyarados or to replace him with the chicken or the ape (this last is preferred)

 

[Random Matt]

The problem is after it dances (a Gyarados that doesn't dance is a KOed Gyarados), when it can outspeed everything I switch in (rendering Blaziken, except the Choice Scarf version, useless). It can then take on Starmie and laugh at thunderbolt, as it will simply avoid the attack and OHKO with Bounce. That little lockdown I got in earlier would likely be resolved with the addition of Ice Punch to Machamp, as it will then hit Gliscor for 4x damage and switch out to come back and Dynamicpunch.

Counter takes out Gyarados as when it attacks Scizor can take the hit (even from +2 Waterfall) and then Gyarados takes double the damage back. With Scizors having it's invested bulk in HP this means that Gyarados with anything other than a Focus Sash will fall to Counter, (and in the remote event that it does have Focus Sash, Bullet Punch prevails).

I may reconsider the Stone Edge vs Crunch on Aerodactyl, although I often lose/sacrifice it at the start to get up SR and start making a dent in the opponent... the Ground/Dark combo seems to cover most of what it gets put up against supereffectively, however the lack of bulk results in taking heavy hits, and often when it's about to be taken out it seems better to sacrifice for a free switch in than switching in to the hit.

 

[Random Matt]

Hi Random Matt. Decent team you've got here.

Your team has some good synergy and offensive prowess, but your item choices are questionable at best. Aerodactyl needs a Focus Sash to get up Rocks against things like Metagross. Starmie should have a Life Orb or Leftovers; Wise Specs don't net any notable KOs for you. I guess that Dragonite's Yache Berry and Weavile's Expert Belt are okay, but I'd think about replacing those with Leftovers and a Choice Band respectively.

As for Machamp, the Choice Scarf lets him outspend a few notable walls, but he's still so slow that most things that threaten him normally are still faster. The only popular pokemon who you could catch by surprise is a Heatran looking to pick you off, but in exchange you make yourself setup bait for many common threats if you get locked in the wrong move; that kind of defeats one of Machamp's main draws, since it's next to impossible to set up on him normally. I recommend you switch him to a normal Lum Berry variant, moving all those Speed EVs into HP. You already have Weavile as a fast and powerful revenge killer, so Scarfing Machamp isn't necessary.

Before I forget, Crunch on Aerodactyl to "help Machamp" is kind of redundant with Weavile, since he can handle any Gengars or Rotoms you encounter.

Good job, and good luck!

Actually it's very rare that I fail to get up SR (and usually it's because I judged it better to break the opponents Focus Sash and switch out to get SR up later). From experience Dragonite has the bulk to take a hit, but not the bulk to make use of leftovers, while Choice Band on Weavile would kill alot of its use and make it easy setup fodder. Like I said I can't afford to drain Starmies HP so fast with LO, and leftovers is taken so really I don't have alot of choice... only other option I can think of is a berry to protect from either Dark or Bug attacks. Machamp works for me as it is, and a regular Machamp is all too predictable (and absolute fodder for Breloom, another thing I really find annoying). Also Weavile is fast, but the power leave a bit to be desired at times, Outspeeding Metagross with Dynamicpunch is also a major boon, the loss of which could prove problematic. Weaviles frailty also means it often loses to Rotom when it switches in to thunderbolt/will-o-wisp/substitute.

 

[aVocado]

i've done some calcs and +2 scizor's bullet punch can also not-2HKO 4/0 gyarados but +2 bug bite can. I don't know how counter can kill gyarados, but you can easily 2HKO him with bug bite after sords dance, or also switch in starmie and OHKO with thunderbolt. Machamp doesn't need thunderpunch due to the multitude of gyarados with wacan berry and no guard stone edge can easily kill gyara. if gyarados has not set-up machamp can easily win, but a +1 waterfall can OHKO machamp, but with a choice scarf you can outspeed an unboosted gyarados with stone edge but then you need a switch in due to your only attack is SE. a pokemon that can easily OHKO both blissey, metagross and gliscor is a mixed infernape with this set:
-fire blast
-close combact
-hp ice
-grass knot/vacuum wave/thunderpunch
it can easily destroy that mons, and with some attack investment can kill gyarados with thunderpunch if he hasn't got any boost. also blaziken can kill these 4 if gliscor and gyarados doesn't have max speed and generally a rest/talker doesn't ave max speed and i saw on shoddy my blaziken outspeeded lots of gyarados because they run a bulkier set, and generally thunderpunch/stone edge killed them. unlukily for macham is not good to be locked in a move, I suggest to give him less speed and more bulk to surely survive a +0 waterfall by gyarados or to replace him with the chicken or the ape (this last is preferred)

Starmie CANNOT switch it on Gyarados, waterfall can probably 2HKO the dang star, and it wouldn't like a bounce or a stone edge to it's face after a dragon dance. Scizor also can't afford taking a waterfall, i don't see your point. His team got nothing to counter Gyarados.

 

[Random Matt]

Starmie CANNOT switch it on Gyarados, waterfall can probably 2HKO the dang star, and it wouldn't like a bounce or a stone edge to it's face after a dragon dance. Scizor also can't afford taking a waterfall, i don't see your point. His team got nothing to counter Gyarados.

Actually work it out, Scizor will survive +2 Waterfall from 252 attack adamant Gyarados.

 

[Adamant Zoroark]

You're not running enough Speed on Weavile.

You need at least 216 Speed EVs, Jolly nature. This will let you hit 373 Speed, allowing you to outspeed positive base 120s like Alakazam and Sceptile, and most importantly, Dugtrio. Also, use Life Orb instead; you get the same versatility as you get with Expert Belt, but a greater power boost and a power boost regardless of whether or not the attack is super effective.

You also have nothing that outspeeds +1 Jolly Gyarados. To fix this, I strongly recommend replacing Machamp with a Choice Scarf Rotom.

Rotom-A @ Choice Scarf (WRONG ITEM)
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Hydro Pump/Overheat
- Trick

Hydro Pump or Overheat depends on which Rotom form you choose (Rotom-W or Rotom-H). This outspeeds all variants of Gyarados and kills it with Thunderbolt.

Counter sucks as a move. I strongly recommend you use the standard Choice Band Scizor or Swords Dance Scizor.

CB Scizor:

Scizor @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- Pursuit

SD Scizor:

Scizor @ Life Orb
Trait: Technician
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Brick Break/Superpower
- Bug Bite/Roost/Quick Attack

Also, I highly recommend Life Orb on Starmie; WiseGlasses does not give you enough of a power boost. Also, run Focus Sash on Aerodactyl (this lets it set up SR against the likes of Metagross), and also run Stone Edge/Rock Slide over Crunch so you can hit fliers, and Rock + Ground coverage is in general much better than Ground + Dark coverage, since the only relevant Pokemon that resist Rock + Ground are Breloom and Bronzong, and it also lets you hit Zapdos for super effective damage.

Hope this helped.

Also, since you run ExtremeSpeed and enough Speed to always outspeed Weavile, Yache Berry isn't necessary. I recommend Life Orb on Dragonite for the extra power.

 

[Random Matt]

Good idea on Weavile, I'll do that!

I'm building the team for itemclause... this puts a stop on some of those plas. And I'm not losing my Rapid Spinner to LO recoil. Yache Berry allows me to set up in the face of an Ice attack, or survive Weaviles Ice Shard (I don't think I'll OHKO with Extremespeed).

 

[2sly4u]

Good idea on Weavile, I'll do that!

I'm building the team for itemclause... this puts a stop on some of those plas. And I'm not losing my Rapid Spinner to LO recoil. Yache Berry allows me to set up in the face of an Ice attack, or survive Weaviles Ice Shard (I don't think I'll OHKO with Extremespeed).

You should put that you're using Item Clause in the OP to avoid confusion. Even knowing that, I'd still give Machamp a new item, or at least test out faster fighting types. Machamp is supposed to be a Wallbreaker, not a sweeper...but to each his own I suppose.

Extremespeed has around a 75% chance to KO after Stealth Rocks at +1. Also, offensive Gyarados always OHKOs max HP Scizor at +2, and Max attack Gyarados with leftovers OHKOs around 80% of the time after Stealth Rocks at +2. I don't know where you're getting your calcs, but they aren't right.

Good luck!

 

[Random Matt]

You should put that you're using Item Clause in the OP to avoid confusion. Even knowing that, I'd still give Machamp a new item, or at least test out faster fighting types. Machamp is supposed to be a Wallbreaker, not a sweeper...but to each his own I suppose.

Extremespeed has around a 75% chance to KO after Stealth Rocks at +1. Also, offensive Gyarados always OHKOs max HP Scizor at +2, and Max attack Gyarados with leftovers OHKOs around 80% of the time after Stealth Rocks at +2. I don't know where you're getting your calcs, but they aren't right.

Good luck!

hmm ok cheers

I've been getting my calcs from here http://www.psypokes.com/dex/damage.php and also this http://pokemon.marriland.com/damage.php. They both gave the same result, that unless Waterfall crits, Scizor will survive +2 Waterfall with atleast 14HP.

Is there somewhere else you can recommend I use instead?

 

[2sly4u]

hmm ok cheers

I've been getting my calcs from here http://www.psypokes.com/dex/damage.php and also this http://pokemon.marriland.com/damage.php. They both gave the same result, that unless Waterfall crits, Scizor will survive +2 Waterfall with atleast 14HP.

Is there somewhere else you can recommend I use instead?

Against BulkyDos he might survive, (are you remembering to factor in Stealth Rocks?), but you aren't taking into account Offensive variants. Here's Smogon's damage calc site. It's much more convenient, and gives percentages, which IMO are more useful.
http://www.smogon.com/calc/

 

[Braseg257]

IMO scarf rotom is the best choice to counter gyara, also I prefer rotom-w, just in case gyarados carryes wacan berry or just to don't be vulnerable to waterfall. also i don't know how scizor can survive to +2 waterfall, i'm going to do some calcs. maybe a phisical defensive tentacruel can help to wall gyara?
and... @random matt, don't think that scarfken is useless, I say this for personal experience, expecially when you see blaziken come into salamence and OHKO with stone edge, is a great surprise factor for a team

EDIT: when I wrote the post about how to counter gyarados my calcs were done with an unboosted gyarados

 

[B-Zard]

Hi,

your teams looks good overall, but I have some suggestions to hopefully make it better.

First thing is that it might be good to replace lead Aero with lead Machamp. Machamp is a pretty good lead which can take on almost any lead. Your Choice Scarf set doesn't make sense and it still doesn't have enough speed to revenge kill. The lead set is as follows:

Lead Machamp set

Machamp @ Lum Berry
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 240 hp | 248 att | 12 spdef | 8 speed
Adamant Nature (+Att/-Spatt)
- DynamicPunch
- Payback
- Ice Punch
- Bullet Punch

Next you need a Stealth Rock user instead of Aero, since Aero doesn't function at laying up SR later in the game. Therefore I suggest using a ShucaTran to lay them up safely. This is the set:

ShucaTran set

Heatran @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 Hp | 252 Spatt | 252 Speed
Timid Nature (+Speed/-Spatt)
- Stealth Rock
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Will-O-Wisp

Only thing about your Starmie set is changing your item to probably Life Orb or Leftovers. Dragonite the same.

Since you lose your Choice Scarfer user Machamp you need another one. I think it is good if Scizor fulfills that role. This is preferred set:

Scarf Scizor set

Scizor @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Technician
EVs: 12 HP | 252 Atk | 244 Spe
Jolly Nature (+Speed/-Spatt)
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- Superpower
- U-turn

For Weavile change your EV spread to this: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe.

Something else, edit your first post if you appied changes to your team. If you look at the format I applied to the new sets, your first post will be more attractive to people and you have a higher chance that people will rate your team.


Hope I helped you and good luck with your team!