Sturdy

[jumpluff]

In the fifth generation, Sturdy changed to work as a pseudo Focus Sash.

The Ability "Sturdy", which used to protect against OHKO attacks (Horn Drill, Fissure, etc.) now negates efforts to OHKO the Pokémon with any move, albeit leaving it with 1 HP.

Okay, I'll be straight up here. We don't know the mechanics of this; that's something for our research team in the near future. Does it work more than once? I assume it only works from full health.

Here are the Pokémon with Sturdy:
Aggron, Bastiodon, Donphan, Forretress, Golem, Magneton/Magnezone, Probopass, Shuckle, Skarmory, Steelix, Sudowoodo
Dream World: Relicanth, Regirock
5th Gen: Dageki, Iwaparesu, Abagoora, Gigaiasu

I'm not sure how Sturdy will interact with entry hazards. Possibly, it will 'break' the Focus Sash. But lead-wise, it has incredible potential. It's early days yet to try to predict the lead metagame, but let's go:

• Skarmory can get guaranteed layer of Spikes, two if it's faster. It can run Lum, Leftovers, or Shed Shell alongside Sturdy to stop sleep, provide healing against non-OHKOing leads, or screw over Magnet Pull Pokémon. Perhaps if it Roosts up while the opponent switches to something that can OHKO Skarmory, Sturdy will work again, letting it get another layer of Spikes against the dangerous foe.
• Donphan and Forretress can Rapid Spin against strong attackers with super effective special hits. In Skarmory's vein, Forry as a lead will become even more effective. Donphan gets Ice Shard, letting it finish off faster, stronger Pokémon who are hit hard by its strong EQ.
• Magnezone will probably prefer Magnet Pull, but there's a niche for a bluffing set (although if you're anything like me, you always check for Arena Trap against Dugtrio, etc.) against Pokémon that OHKO, such as Metagross.
• Steelix, Sudowoodo, and Regirock can all get up Stealth Rock and Explode/Selfdestruct, possibly making decent leads. However, unlike 4th gen's suicide leads (Azelf comes to mind), they may be too slow to pull off an Explosion on the second turn. Gigaiasu is in the same boat, as we've confirmed it gets Explosion.
• Relicanth's main uses, rain dance offense or ridiculously powerful non-recoil Head Smashes, will still hold true, especially with the Dream World abilities making rain more prevalent in OU, so it probably won't go with Sturdy. Our new bulky Water/Rock, Abagoora, gets Solid Rock and has great defensive stats, so I think it'll use that instead, though it gives it a chance against Grass-types.
• Dageki gets a host of cool abilities: Mold Breaker (Dream World), Inner Focus, and, of course, Sturdy. Which one it uses if it's used as a lead (since I think Inner Focus and MB will help it more as an offensive Pokémon) depends on its full movepool. It depends on TMs imo.
• One of Aggron's abilities is also Sturdy, and it gets the rare and awesome move Metal Burst, which allows it to take any damaging attack and deal 150% of it back (kind of like Mirror Coat / Counter, but weaker and works for both physical and special attacks). That gives it some universal surprise kills. That's some utility!
• Custap Berry! Though thwarted by priority, Custap Berry would make even the slower Pokémon able to function as suicide leads, setting up on the first turn while taking a heavy hit, then Custap Berry activates and you go kaboom. In the case of Skarmory, you could guaranteed get two layers of Spikes against a number of Pokémon.

What do you think? I think the main potential lies in old Pokémon being able to set up entry hazards and Rapid Spin against the likes of Heatran, but I might've missed something. It frees up the item slot, leaving room for helpful auxiliary items like Lum Berry and Leftovers (which might help in the non-lead slot if Sturdy works after Roosting, etc., as mentioned before), without the need for Focus Sash. A great way to boost old Pokémon, and there's potential for the new ones, too. Sturdy was always useless in mainstream simulator play because of OHKO clause, so it's good to see an improvement.

On the flip side, a lot of these Pokémon are slow and already bulky, so will they be able to use their ability effectively? I think in the case of like, Skarmory (which btw only gets Keen Eye as an alternative, Sturdy is def. better now..), it won't be a matter of using the ability so much as taking advantage of it. The likes of Sudowoodo probably can't stand up to the big boys, but Aggron has a unique niche that may well give it a use in the lead metagame. In the cases of Spikes leads, if the item Aiming Mark is true (lets you hit a Pokémon with a move it's immune to), spin blocking may become impossible, devaluing multiple layers of Spikes. If our Ghost-types are still hit by Rapid Spin, there go all your Spikes, and you have a crippled Skarmory to show for it. Sturdy still lets them take on boosting attackers, though, so if you can get rid of entry hazards (something important to stall anyway), and in this case it would be easy, you can phaze them out while taking an attack that would otherwise KO.

 

[sax king]

Forretress lead anyone?

Forretress gets all entry hazards, sturdy, and rapid spin. It has great defensive stats too. It can survive Explosion and it takes little from fake out.

 

[PK Gaming]

What's cool is that most of those pokemon resist Stealth Rocks and can heal the SR damage with Lefties.

You forgot to mention that Aggron would serve as an excellent bluffer. Normally people assume an offensive set, but with Sturdy + Metal Burst, Aggron can net a surprise kill.

 

[jumpluff]

Yeah, I think Forretress will be a good lead. Maybe it can hold Leftovers to negate Fake Out, which would screw over Sturdy leads (Infernape > Forry, Skarm, etc.). Hopefully that works, Spikes, TSpikes, and SR are all very useful and I expect they will still be.

 

[Limewire]

Aggron might have some potential as a lead in the lower tiers. Not only can it set up Stealth Rock, but it can also survive an OHKO attack (thanks to Sturdy) and retaliate with Metal Burst. Any opinions?

EDIT: Blast, ninja'd.

 

[jumpluff]

Right, how could I forget Metal Burst? I'll edit that in. ;) We don't know that Aggron will necessarily end up in the lower tiers, but wherever it ends up, the ability to tank any hit and retaliate will serve it well as a bluff set.

 

[Arcticblast]

Sounds interesting. Kyogre BP'd a Sub and +6 Sp. Atk in the rain will no longer KO a level 1 Lax Shuckle using Choice Specs Water Spout.

 

[supermarth64]

Yea I'm being extremely pessimistic about this.

Non-lead: So far, I haven't seen anything that says that SR will be removed or spinning will be easier. Therefore, entry hazards will still be prevalent (seeing as many new Pokemon are offensively based, meaning gradual chip damage will be good for sweepers). This means that trying to get these Pokemon in means that they have to have Leftovers in order to negate SR immediately and any damage they take from switching in will put them outside of 100% HP.

Lead: Skarmory gets 1 layer of Spikes minimum, 2 if the opponent SRs first and is faster (assuming it carries a move that can 2HKO Skarmory). However, in exchange for this, you're left with a 6.25% Skarmory that dies to SR if it switches in and no physical wall for your team to utilize. Forretress is arguably worse off, as it's slower so it can rarely set up more than 2 layers and has to choose between spinning away SR and laying down more entry hazards. As for Steelix, Sudowoodo, and Regirock, all three would need a Custap Berry unless the opponent SRs first because they can only Explode/SD after the opponent attacks.

All in all I see the new Sturdy as a "whoops I messed up but I managed to live with 1 HP and not be a defensive wall anymore". I wouldn't rely on it.

 

[DDRMaster]

I think Donphan is the only one of these Pokemon that gets Sturdy and a priority move (Ice Shard) and most of these Pokemon are extremely slow so I don't think they'll be able to use Sturdy too effectively in the lead position.

I hope this isn't too much speculation, but I think a lead Donphan set could work like this:

Donphan @ Lum Berry/(The item that lets you hit your opponent even if they have an immunity.)
EVs: 252 HP/252 Atk/4 Def
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Sturdy

Earthquake
Ice Shard
Stealth Rock
Rapid Spin

Earthquake is here for STAB and should 2HKO Heatran and Metagross. Ice Shard and Rapid Spin are useful for Pokemon who run Focus Sash as the former will hit them before they get a second move while the latter with keep them from setting up entry hazards. Stealth Rock will still be a good move for leads to set up because some teams might not run Rapid Spinners and it will give you some residual damage until they do. Lum Berry allows you to beat Smeargle and Roserade leads while the second item lets you use Earthquake on fliers and levitators and Rapid Spin on Ghosts.

If you think this is too much speculation, just go ahead and delete/edit this.

 

[jumpluff]

Well, being more serious, Shuckle isn't being OHKOed by much, but it gets Encore (for example, it can Encore a strong super effective attack and switch to something that can better take it) and a lot of other useful moves. So while it's not amazingly useful, it's a help. I'll edit that into my OP.

 

[Alexa888]

Donphan might function well as a lead, with Endeavour, Ice Shard, SR, Rapid Spin, EQ; all with a built in focus sash. Maybe even Custap Berry could be worked onto a set.

EDIT: Ninja'd >.<

 

[Sixonesix]

Sturdy would likely work well with Custap Berry - first turn you attack or set up while taking a nearly fatal hit, next turn you move first and Explode.

 

[Enlong]

I can imagine Sturdy being used with Golem for revenge-killing. Granted, he has to either have Leftovers, or you need to make sure there's no entry hazards, but if he comes in on a sweeper with full health and Sturdy, you can survive a massive hit with 1 HP and use Explosion to take them out.

If you can reliably bring him in on a clear field, you can even give him a Choice Band to make the Explosion stronger.

 

[EvilMario]

It will fully depend on how suicide leads work in the new metagame. If Aiming Mark turns entry hazards into obsolete waste of time, then it won't have much of a warrant. If they continue to play a major role in the metagame, then by all means, this presents us with a host of new leads.

 

[jumpluff]

Yea I'm being extremely pessimistic about this.

Non-lead: So far, I haven't seen anything that says that SR will be removed or spinning will be easier. Therefore, entry hazards will still be prevalent (seeing as many new Pokemon are offensively based, meaning gradual chip damage will be good for sweepers). This means that trying to get these Pokemon in means that they have to have Leftovers in order to negate SR immediately and any damage they take from switching in will put them outside of 100% HP.

Lead: Skarmory gets 1 layer of Spikes minimum, 2 if the opponent SRs first and is faster (assuming it carries a move that can 2HKO Skarmory). However, in exchange for this, you're left with a 6.25% Skarmory that dies to SR if it switches in and no physical wall for your team to utilize. Forretress is arguably worse off, as it's slower so it can rarely set up more than 2 layers and has to choose between spinning away SR and laying down more entry hazards. As for Steelix, Sudowoodo, and Regirock, all three would need a Custap Berry unless the opponent SRs first because they can only Explode/SD after the opponent attacks.

All in all I see the new Sturdy as a "whoops I messed up but I managed to live with 1 HP and not be a defensive wall anymore". I wouldn't rely on it.

However, in exchange for this, you're left with a 6.25% Skarmory that dies to SR if it switches in and no physical wall for your team to utilize.

That's true, I would still be hesitant to keep my Skarmory in on something like Heatran or the new fire chandelier, since one of Skarmory's key assets is its extended survivability. But in a pinch this ability will definitely come in handy. I don't see why we couldn't use Skarmory as this kind of lead, though you would have to forfeit its walling -- it would probably work, though you'd have to be really careful about Spinning, and if Aiming Mark is how it's been translated (letting you hit Pokémon one time with a move it's immune to), Spinning will be incredibly easy, screwing over the use as a suicide Spikes lead. I just thought of another use -- taking strong attacks from boosters such as Dragon Dance Gyarados and Calm Mind Jirachi and phazing them. It'll end up crippled, but that's sure better than in previous gens, where it won't even survive.

 

[pux]

As far as Stealth Rock goes use in this metagame will completely depend on egg moves because as it stands it isn't a TM and none of the Pokemon that learn it by LvUp (Geodude, Onix, Dangoro, Ishizumai) are going to be able to function as a suicide lead.

 

[blasphemy1]

As far as items go, Custap Berry, Leftovers, and Lum Berry seem like the best options. Custap Berry will allow you to get another layer of entry hazards, or pull off another attack.

The most effective Custap users are probably Steelix + Forretress + Gigaiasu, due to their access to Explosion. Stealth Rock -> Custap activation -> Explosion. Steelix gets access to Crunch for Ghost-types, and STAB Earthquake for Steel-types. Forretress gets Payback and Earthquake, but it'll probably want to focus on its access to all the entry hazards. Gigaiasu stands out to me. 135 base attack with STAB Rock is scary indeed, and it also has Explosion.

Leftovers allows you to recovery damage from entry hazards or Fake Out (in lead position), which has its uses on all of these Pokemon because that's what they typically run anyways. In particular, Steelix can switch into Stealth Rock and heal off the residual damage, so it can keep Sturdy in tact.

Lum Berry + Sturdy no longer gives us the issue of choosing: do I want to lose to Infernape leads, or Smeargle? Donphan seems like the best candidate for this strategy, due to its access to Ice Shard, which will allow it to finish off Focus Sash leads like Roserade.

Although slightly off topic, Aiming Mark (item which allows you to bypass immunities) means Rapid Spin will be more difficult to block with Ghost-types. That's why I see attacking leads like Gigaiasu being more effective users.

 

[jumpluff]

Sturdy would likely work well with Custap Berry - first turn you attack or set up while taking a nearly fatal hit, next turn you move first and Explode.

Wow, I forgot that exists, but of course a VGC player would remind me. ^_^ That would be incredibly convenient, though priority, of course, might decrease its effectiveness. There is a move that guards against priority though and not every Pokémon you set up against will have it.

As far as Stealth Rock goes use in this metagame will completely depend on egg moves because as it stands it isn't a TM and none of the Pokemon that learn it by LvUp (Geodude, Onix, Dangoro, Ishizumai) are going to be able to function as a suicide lead.

Well, we don't know if we'll be able to transfer Stealth Rock Pokémon from the 4th gen over, right? If we can than this is kind of moot. Steelix gets Sturdy and a blow up move, btw.

 

[420]

Bluffing could possibly work with magnet pull. From what I've played of the game, doing something illegal actually takes up your move for the turn (ie trying to use a potion on a fainted pokemon). Trying to switch from magnet pull might actually waste your turn as well.

 

[Limewire]

Well, we don't know if we'll be able to transfer Stealth Rock Pokémon from the 4th gen over, right? If we can than this is kind of moot. Steelix gets Sturdy and a blow up move, btw.

IIRC, we should be able to transfer any pokemon from Gen IV without hassle, so SR should see some use. Thing about it, though, is that I doubt many Gen V mon will learn it (it's not a TM anymore, and who in their right mind would want to go to bed with a ROCK?), so it's usage might decline. Might. *shifty eyes*

 

[Darkflagrance]

Bluffing could possibly work with magnet pull. From what I've played of the game, doing something illegal actually takes up your move for the turn (ie trying to use a potion on a fainted pokemon). Trying to switch from magnet pull might actually waste your turn as well.

Nah. Trying to switch out of Magnet Pull or Arena Trap only gets you an error message, and then you go back to the action selection menu.

 

[Little Green Yoda]

Level 1 Sturdy Pineco with Pain Split could be interesting in a doubles TR. A psuedo-Super Fang that hits all types and "restores" the pseudo-Sash too! Throw in Custap for insurance when TR ends.

 

[Rising_Dusk]

I think Forretress leads and Skarmory will see the biggest boosts from Sturdy's change. This is because Forretress is actually a pretty good lead already, and if he switches out and back in with Leftovers (even against SR!) he has 100% HP to activate Sturdy. Skarmory can put it to good use because it can run Roost to heal itself up to Sturdy activation range if heatran switches in or something. Sometimes that last ditch usage of Spikes can be the difference between winning or losing a game!

 

[probationsmack]

Many of you are still thinking of things in the terms of the dppt metagame. You better believe everyone is going to be running Aiming Mark on their rapid spinners. Eventually everyone is going to throw up their hands trying to get stealth rock or entry hazards down and the metagame will shift to a new type of Lead Pokemon paradigm.

 

[Little Green Yoda]

Many of you are still thinking of things in the terms of the dppt metagame. You better believe everyone is going to be running Aiming Mark on their rapid spinners. Eventually everyone is going to throw up their hands trying to get stealth rock or entry hazards down and the metagame will shift to a new type of Lead Pokemon paradigm.

Stealth Rock may not be as prevalent but I think you're kidding yourself if you think SR is going away. Suicide leads will go down because giving up an entire Pokemon for Rocks that may not stay up is inefficient. Bulky SR users (like the ones with Sturdy!) should still be prominent. Even if it takes one turn to spin away the rocks, your team is taking hazard damage until you can get your spinner in.

If Gamefreak nerfed SR's mechanics, then perhaps it'll be different.