Sunny Day VGC 2011

[Tan]

Hi! I have been on smogon for quite a while now and been trying to put a VGC team for a month or so. Last year I lost in the second round so I hope to make a better showing this year! Anyways, I decided to theme this team around Sunny Day, so any help is appreciated. Without further ado:

Sunny D v.1.1

Leads

Whimsicott
Heat Rock
Mischievous Heart
Nature:Timid
Evs:248 Hp/6 Def/248 Sp.Def
Sunny Day
Taunt
Helping Hand
Tailwind

Chandelure
Focus Sash
Flash Fire
Nature: Timid
Evs: 6 Hp/ 252 Sp. Att/252 Spe
Heat Wave
Imprison
Shadow Ball
Trick Room
My Leads. Whimsicott sets up Sunny Day, can use Taunt to stop other weather setters or Trick Room. I'm not sure if I should have encore or tailwind because they both benefit(EDIT: decided on Tailwind)... Basically, this is a lead support pokemon that can only support it's partner with helping hand and such. This brings me to it's partner, Chandelure. His job is either to prevent Trick Room teams, kill off other Chandelures, or sweep with Heat Wave. Imprison basically stops Trick Room and other Chandelures from killing it (Assuming it uses Shadow Ball), while Heat Wave it's the go to move due to it's insane Sp. Att. This lead probably needs work so please give some good advice ^^.

Back Up#1

Darmanitian
Life Orb
Sheer Force
Nature: Adament
Evs:4 Hp/252 Att/252 Spe
Flare Blitz
Brick Break
Rock Slide
Protect

This is basically my physical sweeper. I decided to replace poor little Mienshao due to Smith's advice, which was actually true. His job is simple, use STAB, Sheer Force Flare Blitz boosted with Sunny Day to take out what Chandelure did not, or attack using Rock Slide and Brick Break to prevent any other threat. Paired with Sheer Force and a Life Orb, his attacks hurt.

RIP Mienshao..

Mienshao
Focus Sash
Inner Focus
Nature: Adament
Evs:72 Hp/252 Att/64 Sp.def/120 Spe
Drain Punch
Wide Guard
Fast Guard
Fake Out

This is basically my second support pokemon, He is one of the best Fake Out users in the game, good attack and STAB Drain Punch, and has access to the two guards. It is meant to be a little short-lived due to low HP, so that is why I put a sash on it. I think my EV spread might be off so I would need a little help on that as well. Otherwise, I thought about switching the lead Chandelure with this but I thought Chandelure was a better option. Please correct me if I'm wrong

Back Up#2

Lilligant
Grass Gem
Chlorophyll
Nature: Timid
Evs: 6 Hp/252 Sp.Att/252 Spe
Growth
Sleep Powder
Solarbeam
Hidden Power Fire

Lilligant is my back up sweeper. It seems to be a fast and reliable option if needed. I chose Growth over Quilver Dance because it raise Sp. Att by 2 stages than one. Sleep Powder is good option because it's always good to give a status problem and Growth up. I decided Solarbeam because its consistent and my tests show the sun fading not to be a problem. I know BlueCookies prefers Leaf Storm but I not really convinced. I chose HP fire not only because Smith told me to, but I decided 8 turns with the sun is plenty and Lilligent need more attacking moves than protect.

Please feel free to take apart my team and give my suggestions. this is the first RMT in a while so be gentle ^^. Anyways Thanks alot!

 

[Smith]

Aha what's up Tan! It's weird rating teams of yours offline but I'm afraid it'll have to be a little more professional *ahem*. Sun teams in this metagame actually aren't terrible (as many people might think) so I'm glad your noobishness has payed off (yeah screw the professional bit). However, I still absolutely do think that you need to fix it up a bit. The main thing I see would be Mienshao. I'm pretty sure it's a remnant from the previous version of this team but it really doesn't help with the sun thing at all, so I'd remove it.

Things that benefit from sun the most are obviously things weak to water attacks, things that can abuse fire moves and shit like that. Something I've been using that would really like the sun would be Darmanitan! Just pump 252 / 252 / 4 and Flare Blitz / Rock Slide / Brick Break / Protect. As for an item, I'd love to suggest Focus Sash but I think you should give that to your Shadelure actually. It's really not very bulky and if you can set up Tailwind with Whimsicott (much better than Encore so please use that), he'll piss a lot of people off. I would instead try Life Orb, as, with Sheer Force, your attacks become ridiculously mighty.

It also looks like you're confused by Lilligant. I like Grass gem a lot more personally because Lilligent can actually take a hit or two, and I just gave LO to Darmanitan nbd. Solarbeam > Leaf Storm, consistency is big and it's only 20 more power. Instead of Protect or Sunny Day, try HP Fire, to be boosted by the sun and give you great coverage.

Well there's only four 'mons so nothing much else to note, so yeah good luck and stuff. Lemme know how this work tomorrow or something.

 

[Tan]

Aha what's up Tan! It's weird rating teams of yours offline but I'm afraid it'll have to be a little more professional *ahem*. Sun teams in this metagame actually aren't terrible (as many people might think) so I'm glad your noobishness has payed off (yeah screw the professional bit). However, I still absolutely do think that you need to fix it up a bit. The main thing I see would be Mienshao. I'm pretty sure it's a remnant from the previous version of this team but it really doesn't help with the sun thing at all, so I'd remove it.

Things that benefit from sun the most are obviously things weak to water attacks, things that can abuse fire moves and shit like that. Something I've been using that would really like the sun would be Darmanitan! Just pump 252 / 252 / 4 and Flare Blitz / Rock Slide / Brick Break / Protect. As for an item, I'd love to suggest Focus Sash but I think you should give that to your Shadelure actually. It's really not very bulky and if you can set up Tailwind with Whimsicott (much better than Encore so please use that), he'll piss a lot of people off. I would instead try Life Orb, as, with Sheer Force, your attacks become ridiculously mighty.

It also looks like you're confused by Lilligant. I like Grass gem a lot more personally because Lilligent can actually take a hit or two, and I just gave LO to Darmanitan nbd. Solarbeam > Leaf Storm, consistency is big and it's only 20 more power. Instead of Protect or Sunny Day, try HP Fire, to be boosted by the sun and give you great coverage.

Well there's only four 'mons so nothing much else to note, so yeah good luck and stuff. Lemme know how this work tomorrow or something.

Ok I tried out a quick battle with it and Darma worked pretty well! Ok I made adjustments to Smith's suggestion. Thanks Smithers!

 

[mudkipmaster]

Just a nitpick, Shandera really doesn't need Imprison because if TR IS in effect, using Trick Room makes "The dimensions return to normal".

Otherwise, pretty good team, I see that a Meinshao (Did I spell that right) in the lead position could beat you. Fake Out outspeeds +1 priority Sunny Day, and in turn two you get Sunny Day up, but get murdered by Acrobat.

Great Team (WAYYYY better than mine),
-MUDKIPZ4EVERZ

 

[Fantom0]

Imprison shuts down TR, but for how long, I don't know.

Anyways, I will say that Whimsicott should have an EV spread of 252 HP/36 Def/220 Spe so it can outspeed the genies (although they don't have Taunt very often anymore, it's always worth being more prepared).
Also, I've never been a big fan of stat-boosting moves in doubles and when you have limited turns due to sunlight, it can really hinder you. What's better: KOing that pokemon there or setting up so you can KO that pokemon later? Quite often the best teams will run enough offensive pressure to keep you from getting up a Growth without the risk of being flat-out KOed. I would suggest a Sunny Day there as it is always useful to run dual set-up just in case. The first battle I lost on random match-up on b/w was against someone who used two pokemon with TR.

Hope I Helped!

 

[Tan]

Imprison shuts down TR, but for how long, I don't know.

Anyways, I will say that Whimsicott should have an EV spread of 252 HP/36 Def/220 Spe so it can outspeed the genies (although they don't have Taunt very often anymore, it's always worth being more prepared).
Also, I've never been a big fan of stat-boosting moves in doubles and when you have limited turns due to sunlight, it can really hinder you. What's better: KOing that pokemon there or setting up so you can KO that pokemon later? Quite often the best teams will run enough offensive pressure to keep you from getting up a Growth without the risk of being flat-out KOed. I would suggest a Sunny Day there as it is always useful to run dual set-up just in case. The first battle I lost on random match-up on b/w was against someone who used two pokemon with TR.

Hope I Helped!

I tried the new spread and it did out speed the genie, but it got OHKO by Acrobat shortly afterwards. I think I would go sunnyd over growth like you suggested because I realize I don't growth as much and need that offense. Thanks

Just a nitpick, Shandera really doesn't need Imprison because if TR IS in effect, using Trick Room makes "The dimensions return to normal".

Otherwise, pretty good team, I see that a Meinshao (Did I spell that right) in the lead position could beat you. Fake Out outspeeds +1 priority Sunny Day, and in turn two you get Sunny Day up, but get murdered by Acrobat.

Great Team (WAYYYY better than mine),
-MUDKIPZ4EVERZ

I use Imprison also to prevent other shanderas from killing me too. A little dumb I know but it has saved me before. I also realize the Mienshao problem, but I'm not sure how to change this without changing a lot.

 

[Wildfire]

Fantom0,
Imprision stays in affect as long as the pokemon who uses it stays on the field.

So if shandera dies, trick room can be used. An option that might be useful, might not, is imprision protect. Others don't get to protect during tailwind leaving you with 4 turns instead of 2 to use it. That takes away from your coverage though.

For lilligant, growth is +1 attack and +1 speacial attack. It got altered from gen4 to gen5.

Have you considered valcorona for the 4th or 3rd position? It has an amazing speacial attack and anger powder.

For themes, I'm not sure if relying on sunny day to stay up is such a good idea. Whimsicott is probably not going to survive for long. If your putting up sunny day the first turn, that gives the opponent the advantage. Leads with fire type moves will get the boost and KO whimsicott first turn. Ex. hydreigon with flamethrower.
Then your left without tailwind and darmanitan can't outspeed hydreigon with a timid nature and use brick break. In fact, you don't really have a counter for that pokemon. Volcorona can outspeed and KO with bug buzz.