Usable (and Good) NFE (both non- and with Eviolite) Pokemon in RU

[col49]

Considering the vastly limited amount of Steel types, I've actually been playing around with Shelgon and Fraxure with moderate success. Here's what I was playing around with:
Shelgon (M) @ Eviolite
Trait: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Atk / 208 SDef / 12 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Outrage/Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

Playing off his excellent bulk with Eviolite, Shelgon can make a rather effective Mono-Attacker. Don't ask me about the EVs, they had some reason behind him them, I just don't recall for sure what that is :P

Shelgon (M) @ Eviolite
Trait: Rock Head
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Bold/Relaxed Nature
- Draco Meteor/Dragon Claw
- Flamethrower
- Wish
- Roar/Protect/Body Slam

Same play style as Fatmence really, minus Intimidate and Roost. This guy can stop a fair deal of physical attackers cold, as well as provide Wish support.

Fraxure (M) @ Eviolite/Life Orb
Trait: Mold Breaker
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 24 SDef / 228 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Outrage/Dual Chop
- Dragon Dance
- Taunt/Reversal
- Dual Chop/Substitute

I really did not know how shallow Fraxure's movepool was 'til recently, but it's pretty barren :P Nonetheless, he does still make a solid user of DD.

 

[Axmaster68]

Is Speed Boost Combusken RU? If it is, it could run an of Blaziken's sets, but I like the SD set best out of all.

 

[Cloud 8]

Is Speed Boost Combusken RU? If it is, it could run an of Blaziken's sets, but I like the SD set best out of all.

Discussed on the previous page but the gist is it misses out on HJK whhich greatly limits his offensive prowress. 85 attack isnt really winning him any awards and with pathetic bulk without eviolite; basically everything can take a hit and kill him off. Things get even worse when you consider the abundance of bulky Mons that wall him like Blastoise and Claydol.

 

[Oglemi]

aight I've updated the OP with most of the things suggested thus far, if you anybody has anything else they think should be added, go ahead and post it.

Otherwise, this is simply the place to discuss any of the NFE Pokemon we got in RU!

 

[Oglemi]

Double post cuz I can

Some things I want people to try out and post there successes/failures with:

Rapid Spin Staryu

Defensive Lairon

Speed Boost Combusken (I know it's been discussed a little bit, but I really want people to post logs on this one)

Defensive Electabuzz

Offensive Gabite

Defensive Pineco

Defensive Metang

Offensive Monferno

Defensive Piloswine

Offensive Sneasel

Defensive Vibrava

 

[col49]

I've been thinking about whether or not Eviolite Vibrava would be viable, but his piddling defenses turned me off the idea :/ Nonetheless, I suppose it wouldn't hurt to try out

 

[marilli]

I'll post my experiences with few of the Evio mons few posts above.

Rapid Spin Staryu: Most definitely biased, but IMO this is legit. Recover is a godsend to eviolite mons. Too bad its base stats suck too much to serve as mixed tank (which most eviolite mons would be with 50% recovery) Just stick with physical defense (really, resisted surfs do wayyy too much to this.) Natural Cure and semi-immunity to toxic and scald burn is also helpful. Successful, but not as amazing as i make it out to be.

Defensive Pineco: Forry's best thing is its Steel typing. With no reliable recovery and SR weakness, it's not staying alive all that long. It also happens to be the biggest setup bait ever. Not recommended unless you seriously need to pile on hazards + rapid spin and you have only 1 teamslot left. And even then, probably it's just better to split the job between two other mons. If you need SR, just do it with one of the steel mons. If you need Spikes / TSpikes more, even Qwilfish is more viable of a Fighting-resist physical spiker. Spinning SR'er? Claydol does that better. I don't like it at all, IMO.

Defensive Metang & Lairon: Steel typing is really really cool in RU. This is specifically for Lairon, but even with that horrible weaknesses, Steel typing seriously makes up for a lot. While they're cool and all, but for me, Steelix was the better defensive Steel. Viable alternatives of sorts, I guess-- you get infinitely better special defense for the Leftovers recovery. Didn't work for me, but I see the potential.

Piloswine: Is a Curse set considered defensive? I tried the Curse set, and it's not bad at all. Good coverage as usual, and priority can be helpful. Hail support is IMO a luxury--it's hard to find a slot for another ice type in a Hail team. It's got enough special defense to win vs most electrics, which can be a trouble to some teams. It can also SR up with plenty of HP left. Pretty decent for an overlooked eviolite mon.

Sneasel: Not a personal one, but I've seen many CB Sneasels on the ladder. Really effective considering the three 'broken' mons in Cresselia, Yanmega, and Honchkrow all die to it. (CB Punishment for Cress because Night Slash will just tickle because I'm stupid and it doesn't get Night Slash, and take it out with when it doesn't have a sub.) Other than that, the usability kinda falls short. Strong-ish priority is cool I guess. Good if (and only if) you have trouble with those 3 mons.

 

[Foxy Grandpa]

Sneasel: Not a personal one, but I've seen many CB Sneasels on the ladder. Really effective considering the three 'broken' mons in Cresselia, Yanmega, and Honchkrow all die to it. (CB Punishment for Cress because Night Slash will just tickle, and take it out with when it doesn't have a sub.) Other than that, the usability kinda falls short. Strong-ish priority is cool I guess. Good if (and only if) you have trouble with those 3 mons.

I use CB Sneasel a lot and in my case it doesn't only check those three pokes. Priority is always nice and with his great speed he can use Ice Punch most of the time. O and one minor nitpick, Sneasel doesn't learn Night Slash :)

 

[Scoopapa]

Electabuzz is pretty cool. The big question is do you go special defense or physical defense; basically, a reliable special wall vs. a not-quite wall that can abuse Static. I went with specially, being that it's RU, and it's pretty decent. A Sleep Talk set with Discharge and HP Ice / Cross Chop is pretty cool for a bulky offense team that wants to spread paralysis. Unfortunately when I was using it I was trying to use MG Alakazam, so I ended up using it in DW OU. I would have to test it a bit more to really give a reliable judgement. Then there's the fact that holy shit Ampharos gets Cotton Guard and can set up in Rhyperior's face with no Def EV's...but I digress.

I also used defensive Metang early early on (my first random RU team) and when I did it seemed sorta meh. Bulky yes, reliable SR setter yes, but the 75 base atk and no leftovers was a bummer. I think just as most other eviolite mons without natural recovery, a RestTalk set is the only way to really make it work. Hone Claws + Meteor Mash could be cool though. I will try to test that one too.

Also I don't think Sneasel has much use outside of countering some specific threats. I like to run teams with all sorts of non-standard sets (to me that's the fun of RU), and sneasel has never really been a problem. I wouldn't advertise it as anything more than a utility counter admittedly it's great to revenge kill Yanmega-Cresselia-Honchkrow-Liligant though).

 

[Honko]

Double post cuz I can

Stop the garbage pc++ you monster.

Try this set it's Really Good.

Bonsly
50 HP / 80 Atk / 95 Def / 10 SpA / 45 SpD / 10 Spe

Bonsly @ Eviolite
Ability: Rock Head / Sturdy
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
- Curse
- Rock Slide
- Sucker Punch
- Double-Edge / Low Kick

 

[Jaetheho]

ive seen eviolite fraxure with dd and taunt. its really good once it sets up.

 

[marilli]

Just tried out Eviolite Metang with RestTalk + Hone Claws + Meteor Mash. I was lazy and was running those stupid 252 HP / 252 Atk spreads. It was quite good--you can tank super effective hits (albeit with less than 50% health left) as long as they're not strong STAB, so offense sometimes has trouble, if they don't have anything to overpower it / don't have more than two things to severely damage it.

Too bad its initial Meteor Mashes are too weak to deter Fire-type switches on turn 1 it's out--so SR is a must. Against defensive teams, though, I got tired of getting walled by Quagsires and pHazed out by Whirldwind Mandibuzz / Roar Steelix / Roar Blastoise / whatever have you. With smart teambuilding, RestTalk Metang shouldn't be a threat (unless you have team support and is good enough to forcibly remove his pHazer from play) IMO Boosting with a restalk set is really not that good in BW. You'll force them to pHaze you with the boosting move, and guess what? if they keep on pHazing long enough, you'll never ever wake up. It's almost as if you're forcing the opponent to make the doubly-right play.

 

[HuntSaboteur]

That's a long list.

Misdreavus gets Inferno now, so it might gain in usage once Spooky Manor is released on PO. Inferno would be a hugely valuable tool against Bug Types. (Can Inferno burn Entei do you know?)

I'm surprised more people don't use evio Duosion, I have to say. This is a prevo of a top-tier OU with the same SpA.

 

[HuntSaboteur]

Also, taking any hit from Entei bar Stone Edge is a bad thing for Lampent. LOTei>CBTei.

 

[Molk]

That's a long list.

Misdreavus gets Inferno now, so it might gain in usage once Spooky Manor is released on PO. Inferno would be a hugely valuable tool against Bug Types. (Can Inferno burn Entei do you know?)

I'm surprised more people don't use evio Duosion, I have to say. This is a prevo of a top-tier OU with the same SpA.

the problem is that inferno only has 50% accuracy

 

[Oglemi]

This is the Staryu set I was playing around with last night, and I actually think it has potential once Blastoise leaves the tier.

Staryu @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Nature: Bold (+Def, -Atk)
- Rapid Spin
- Recover
- Toxic
- Surf / Scald

The lack of offense is a little disappointing, but being basically immune to status and having instant recovery is amazing.

I tried Vibrava out too, and I found it highly disappointing. This is what I was running:

Vibrava @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Nature: Impish (+Def, -SpA)
- U-turn
- Toxic
- Earthquake
- Draco Meteor / Outrage

Vibrava offers basically nothing to the team outside of a slow U-turn and Toxic. Its Earthquake and Outrage is laughably weak.

Has anybody found a use for Vibrava?

 

[marilli]

@Oglemi: That Staryu set is very good--i've always been a big proponent of Rapid Spin Staryu. For the second set, Vibrava does get Roost, which might be an ok option to look into as a physical wall... It's so weak and it's a bad setup fodder (so might as well die quickly), but it's an option I guess.

EDIT: I really don't see the reason to run Vibrava over Gligar, for example. It has Stealth Rock for one (which Vibrava would kill for), and Gligar's got legitimate defenses. U-turn and Toxic are the only things Vibrava can do, and Gligar can do those just as well. The only 'advantage' is the Dragon typing--which really doesn't matter when your Draco Meteors / Outrages are depressingly weak.

 

[No Luck Involved]

I have only tried Lairon, Metang, Combusken and Monferno from the list. Metang, Combusken and Monferno were just plain unusable because of lack of real power or bulk or movepool. Combusken is semi-threatening if it gets an SD but switching in safely + trying to set up + surviving the sweep is not realistic for the little chicken especially when it doesn't get many OHKOs even at +2. It also cannot get past the likes of Cresselia, Rhyperior, Claydol etc so most teams have a solid answer to it.

Lairon is quite interesting because that beast is so bulky! It can tank physical attacks, it can tank special attacks, it can phaze and set SR, it can hit hard with Head Smash. In fact it can almost be viable if it wasn't for the lack of reliable recovery. It's sad but unfortunately it just falls short of being useful :(

 

[waterwarrior]

Misdreavus gets Inferno now, so it might gain in usage once Spooky Manor is released on PO. Inferno would be a hugely valuable tool against Bug Types. (Can Inferno burn Entei do you know?)

Like MoltenKyurem said, it never hits. Its like saying "Why don't all Iron Fist Golurk's run Dynamic Punch?"

And Sneasel is used for more than the top 3. It can beat Ferroseed, Claydol, Sceptile, Archeops... the list goes on. I've had several Sneasel sweeps with Ice Punch. Don't under-estimate the little weasel. EDIT: will post a log when possible, I'm pretty busy and I'm not playing RU most of the time in PO these days.

 

[kniteowl]

i'm Surprise this guy hasn't been mentioned yet

NATU

YOU KNOW THE ONLY USER OF MAGIC BOUNCE IN THE TIER *face palm* LOL ah well this little guy is easily forgotten with it's many problems.

[SET]
name: Evolite
move 1: Roost
move 2: Night Shade
move 3: Thunder wave
move 4: Toxic / Confuse Ray
item: Evolite
ability: Magic Bounce
nature: Bold / Calm
evs: 252 HP / 252 Def or Spd / 4 Spd or Def

This guy's niche is magic bounce and is solely used to bounce back enemy support moves and doesn't have much besides that but it's niche enough. I think this guy walls ferroseed entirely even if ferroseed has an attack it can roost it off, as long as there are no rocks on the field as in switches it constantly to stop feroseed.

Roost for recovery

Night Shade for consistent damage, this guy has no offensive presence.

the last two slots are support moves, Toxic and Thunder wave are genrally the go too filler moves, it's recommended that you use confuse ray together with thunder-wave for parafuse.

Other options are U-turn for slow switches and Haze but there are other pokemon that are better at hazing, Trick Room is a option as Natu is the only trick roomer with Magic bounce that is slow enough to take advantage of it, especially when you combine it with U-turn.

PS: Espeon and Xatu are too fast to take advantage of trick room but they're OU and UU So it doesn't matter, This guy might end up not viable in RU if XAtu falls to RU but Xatu is Still UU as of today so he's good enough.

Piloswine can pull off a Mono Attack with Curse and Rest Talk but Laparas does it better with better bulk and left overs recovery, and a better ability with water absorb. Obviously their biggest difference is Stealth Rock weakness and different weaknesses in general.

Sadly Thick Fat Piloswine can't learn Sleep Talk... yet but it would be extremely useful It could.

Instead I'll use Piloswine on a hail team for Snow Cloak hax but I find myself going back to using reliable Duosion in hail as my slow tank sweeper.

[SET]
name: Mono-swine
move 1: Curse
move 2: Rest
move 3: Sleep Talk / Substitute
move 4: Icicle Crash / Icicle Spear / Avalanche
item: Evolite
ability: Snow Cloak
nature: Careful
evs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Att

Curse for boosting

Rest for Recovery

Sleep talk so you're not a sitting duck while you're asleep.

Substitute gives you 101 HP subs to wall pokemon using Night Shade and Seismic Toss.

The Last slot depends on what kind of attack you want

Icicle Crash is the most reliable in terms of damage output but has less then perfect accuracy

Icicle Spear can hit multiple times to break subs and has 100% accuracy

Avalanche gets a Boost if you hit second which will be most of the time after you use curse

Ice Shard can be used but won't hit as hard as others but gets priority, you may want to changed the EVs and switch them into attack to hit harder with ice shard.

Earthquake is an option but only after you take out all the flyers and Levitators.

 

[waterwarrior]

Natu isn't used because
1. Let's face it, its ridiculously easy to predict a switch-in to a Natu
2. Even if you do bounce Rocks/ Spikes, its not going to force out anything else. Its not like Espeon where it can actually deal damage to common entry hazards pokes, whereas Natu can beat... Ferroseed... if the other player is stupid. Steelix, Crustle, Cloydol, you name it can all beat Natu.

 

[Enroyalle]

I've used Eviolite Metang on one of my RU teams with good success. A simple moveset of Stealth Rock | Meteor Mash | Earthquake | Bullet Punch gets the job done. It's very reliable at getting up SR due to its good typing, and Bullet Punch makes a fine last-ditch priority.

 

[Ride The Lightning]

Was thinking about Trapinch (Arena Trap, possible trick room sweeper), and Yanma (Compoundeyes + Hypnosis), but Butterfree probably does it better.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

I am completely theorymoning this, but what about Duskull? With eviolite, it takes about the same damage from the old Leftovers Dusclops. It even has levitate over it, and in comparison to other NFEs, it actually has a half decent support movepool, a decent recovery option, heck even consistant damage with night shade.

Sorry if this looks kinda stupid, because I don't play RU at all yet. But if its not applicable at all, I would like to know why, out of curiousity.

 

[No Luck Involved]

Well Dusknoir is in the tier, the only thing Duskull has is Levitate but Dusknoir has Leftovers plus more bulk. Rotom can perform as a defensive levitating Ghost too and it is much more versatile offensively.