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A completely new Standard OU metagame?
- Thread starter red12345
- Start date
Kingdra doesn't really need much more than Waterfall and Outrage (Resisted by...Empoleon and Shedinja?) on the physical side. Besides, it's not like it has to be physical. Special is viable, and mixed Kingdra performs beautifully.
I don't see the need of more tiers, only a playable NU-tier maybe.
So a lot of people do not seem to be getting the real issue behind wanting a new tier system.
What a lot are saying is (in general) "You can still use the pokemon you want to use in higher tiers. We do not need a new system." Okies, now what do you think UU was made for? So people could use the pokes they want to use and not worry about them being "gimmicky," or "outclassed."
Alright, as an example to make people get the problem here a bit better, I like to play Monopoly. I love to acquire all those cooler properties that really might just not be not worth it.....I'd pay say half of my money (which is not smart) just to get them because that's how I like to play. Now given that's my favorite way to enjoy the game, I'm going to lose. A lot. And a lot. And so eventually I'd be forced to play in a way which I do not find quite as pleasant, or otherwise be frustrated from losing and just quit altogether. Same thing for pokemon...it really sucks if you have to use GARCHOMP, MOLTRES, KYOGRE (or some equivalent) just to win a SINGLE game in any given tier environment when all you have ever wanted in life was to use an SD Lickilicky set.
Now as far as a new tiering system, I only see two options, one being adding a new banlist tier for NU so that meta can be properly developed, or implementing Cryxalis's idea (by the way, can that mod who locked/closed his thread please explain that to me? It was good discussion, and I feel his little invention was near flawless).
NU is by far the largest tier, and as such, like in any tier, a few pokes will rise to the top and dominate it. But with so many pokemon, that means that those hundreds below Espeon, Magmortar, etc. will truly be the NU of NU of pokemon. Adding a new balist tier for NU, say ANU (Almost Never-Used) for instance, would allow the pokes in NU that still actually have some competitive potential to be used, however infrequently for people who still like them, and for the sake of NU's own meta health. For those who say we should add to the BL/new NU BL to make them legitimate tiers, then there will be a problem with the current system. When BL develops into its own meta, then people will want a banlist for that. When that develops into ITS own meta, people will want another banlist, and so on.
However, if we were to try out what Cryxalis put forth, we could eventually do away with the old Tier system. I couldn't find his thread from last night, so I'll try to summarize what he said. Bascially you would assign a point value to each pokemon, like from 1-10, and then you would construct a team of pokemon. Whatever total point value or mean your team had, you would be matched with a team of similar value. And certain rules would be in place to prevent something like a team of 5 Magikarps (1) and one Mewtwo (9-10) playing against a more balanced team, such as "the point difference between any two of your pokemon cannot exceed seven," or whatever. In trying this out we could create two separate shoddy servers, or add this system onto the current one as an alternate option to the old system. If this one were to overtake the old tier system, we could use it instead. The benefits would be enormous, because this could potentially create an entirely balanced overall metagame, where no one strategy would dominate, and the game would finally be 100% fair and differentiated.
What a lot are saying is (in general) "You can still use the pokemon you want to use in higher tiers. We do not need a new system." Okies, now what do you think UU was made for? So people could use the pokes they want to use and not worry about them being "gimmicky," or "outclassed."
Alright, as an example to make people get the problem here a bit better, I like to play Monopoly. I love to acquire all those cooler properties that really might just not be not worth it.....I'd pay say half of my money (which is not smart) just to get them because that's how I like to play. Now given that's my favorite way to enjoy the game, I'm going to lose. A lot. And a lot. And so eventually I'd be forced to play in a way which I do not find quite as pleasant, or otherwise be frustrated from losing and just quit altogether. Same thing for pokemon...it really sucks if you have to use GARCHOMP, MOLTRES, KYOGRE (or some equivalent) just to win a SINGLE game in any given tier environment when all you have ever wanted in life was to use an SD Lickilicky set.
Now as far as a new tiering system, I only see two options, one being adding a new banlist tier for NU so that meta can be properly developed, or implementing Cryxalis's idea (by the way, can that mod who locked/closed his thread please explain that to me? It was good discussion, and I feel his little invention was near flawless).
NU is by far the largest tier, and as such, like in any tier, a few pokes will rise to the top and dominate it. But with so many pokemon, that means that those hundreds below Espeon, Magmortar, etc. will truly be the NU of NU of pokemon. Adding a new balist tier for NU, say ANU (Almost Never-Used) for instance, would allow the pokes in NU that still actually have some competitive potential to be used, however infrequently for people who still like them, and for the sake of NU's own meta health. For those who say we should add to the BL/new NU BL to make them legitimate tiers, then there will be a problem with the current system. When BL develops into its own meta, then people will want a banlist for that. When that develops into ITS own meta, people will want another banlist, and so on.
However, if we were to try out what Cryxalis put forth, we could eventually do away with the old Tier system. I couldn't find his thread from last night, so I'll try to summarize what he said. Bascially you would assign a point value to each pokemon, like from 1-10, and then you would construct a team of pokemon. Whatever total point value or mean your team had, you would be matched with a team of similar value. And certain rules would be in place to prevent something like a team of 5 Magikarps (1) and one Mewtwo (9-10) playing against a more balanced team, such as "the point difference between any two of your pokemon cannot exceed seven," or whatever. In trying this out we could create two separate shoddy servers, or add this system onto the current one as an alternate option to the old system. If this one were to overtake the old tier system, we could use it instead. The benefits would be enormous, because this could potentially create an entirely balanced overall metagame, where no one strategy would dominate, and the game would finally be 100% fair and differentiated.
That's a fallacious topic to bring up in this thread. This thread is about the new OU metagame.