It seems the misrepresentation at first glance would be going both ways.
When I spoke about your implication it was in direct response to what you said. And I quote: "If Iron Fist offensive sets aren't cutting it for you though, the offensive route might not be the way to go because Iron Fist is the least impactful offensive ability option." You said this in a manner that made it clear you a) wanted to go for the least offensive, offensive option and b) if that option (re: Iron Fist) wasn't offensive enough--compared to Tough Claws, which your comparison of calcs to explicitly show that much power is too much of a buff in your opinion--people should potentially think of defensive measures to update Kitsunoh. Regenerator aside, your suggestion that other abilities would be undesirable makes no sense. If the idea is to buff it up offensively, Tough Claws or Sheer Force would be much more desirable than Iron Fist unless you deem them too powerful. In which case, logically, the only other way to interpret what you said about Iron Fist is exactly how I interpreted it and you conveyed it: that Iron Fist is the best offensive approach to Kitsunoh that isn't TOO offensive. As for the claim that Regenerator gives an indirect offensive buff to Life Orb sets, you're correct. But I laid that out alongside my comparison of Kitsunoh to other similar pivots in Mienshao and Tornadus-T.
In regards to the hindrance of choice items, I think that's a given. Which is why I stated it so plainly. But your outrageous claim that I'm suggesting you're saying anything is ludicrous. Because I'm not. What I said was, and again I'll quote: "I agree, Band/Scarf don't make use of Kitsunoh's abilities. The reason it's an "extreme hinderance" for Kitsunoh is because Kitsunoh is most effective when it's able to play an indirect role spreading status, removing hazards and messing with momentum." I never quoted you here except for to mock your spelling mistake. What I said is, and this should be clear, is my own opinion and not me putting words in your mouth. I quoted the only bit of your statement that mattered for the point I was making (that banded items on Kitsunoh are bad) and that this option shouldn't be considered except as a gimmick. I don't know how you can construe that as me putting words in your mouth and taking what you said out of context, but in doing so you've failed to show how I took what you said out of context. I quoted you twice; once was to add on my own point about Choice-items and the other was to object to your notion of, as I've concluded, Iron Fist being the optimal offensive-oriented buff.
I read your whole post and agree that it has a niche use with Iron Fist, but that niche misrepresents both the idea behind Kitsunoh as well as its current set of skills. If you're running Iron Fist you're going to want to run at least 2/3 of the accessible moves Kitsunoh has to make the most functionality of Iron Fist. Otherwise, why bother? Plus you're going to want Shadow Strike if it's an offensive set. Plus Kitsunoh is a scout/pivot (scouting in Gen 7 potentially also being a pivot) and thus you'd want U-Turn as well. But what about Defog, which as a utility move you yourself put priority to. So you're looking at something like this:
- Meteor Mash
- Thunder/Ice Punch
- Shadow Strike
- U-Turn/Defog
And what is this, really? Sure, it hits harder in some sort of offensive way, but it doesn't really pivot and if it does, it does it worse now. If you don't run Defog and/or status Colossoil is going to outclass you as a pivot. If you don't run U-Turn, you suddenly aren't a pivot and are working counterproductive to what Kitsunoh's identity actually is. If you don't run 2/3 Iron Fist moves, you're better off running Limber (or Frisk). If you don't run Shadow Strike on an offensive set, that's dumb. What you end up with when you use Iron Fist is move slot syndrome where your ability clashes with your concept and you end up creating this oddly worse Frankenstein. Which is why I straight up asked the question: would you honestly use Iron Fist over Limber (and Frisk)? 9/10, I doubt it. Mega-Metagross does that better, right?
Lastly, yes, Regenerator is generically good. I don't disagree with that statement. What I disagree with is this reverse notion that because something is generically good it's an automatic no. In Kitsunoh's case, it's frail and has average offensive nature. It's quick, but since Generation 5 it's only slightly above average quick (particularly in CAP where a lot of offense-oriented Pokemon have 110+ Speed). Kitsunoh is a well-rounded pivot whose offensive capabilities lay in revenge killing. Not going toe-to-toe and certainly not stallbreaking. When you compare Kitsunoh to other pokemon who have Regenerator you can clearly see a distinction, which I noted. Kitsunoh is the perfect pokemon to receive Regenerator because it buffs it up in such a manner that Regenerator isn't the overwhelming first choice and even when it is in effect, it isn't broken or unfair; because Regenerator matches Kitsunoh's identity like a glove matches a hand. I've laid out facts for why Kitsunoh isn't just any pokemon when it comes to applying Regenerator. If you're going to refuse Regenerator it'd be good, at least since it's on the table, to see some hard proof for why it's not a good idea other than 'it's generically good so let's avoid at all cost'.
When I spoke about your implication it was in direct response to what you said. And I quote: "If Iron Fist offensive sets aren't cutting it for you though, the offensive route might not be the way to go because Iron Fist is the least impactful offensive ability option." You said this in a manner that made it clear you a) wanted to go for the least offensive, offensive option and b) if that option (re: Iron Fist) wasn't offensive enough--compared to Tough Claws, which your comparison of calcs to explicitly show that much power is too much of a buff in your opinion--people should potentially think of defensive measures to update Kitsunoh. Regenerator aside, your suggestion that other abilities would be undesirable makes no sense. If the idea is to buff it up offensively, Tough Claws or Sheer Force would be much more desirable than Iron Fist unless you deem them too powerful. In which case, logically, the only other way to interpret what you said about Iron Fist is exactly how I interpreted it and you conveyed it: that Iron Fist is the best offensive approach to Kitsunoh that isn't TOO offensive. As for the claim that Regenerator gives an indirect offensive buff to Life Orb sets, you're correct. But I laid that out alongside my comparison of Kitsunoh to other similar pivots in Mienshao and Tornadus-T.
In regards to the hindrance of choice items, I think that's a given. Which is why I stated it so plainly. But your outrageous claim that I'm suggesting you're saying anything is ludicrous. Because I'm not. What I said was, and again I'll quote: "I agree, Band/Scarf don't make use of Kitsunoh's abilities. The reason it's an "extreme hinderance" for Kitsunoh is because Kitsunoh is most effective when it's able to play an indirect role spreading status, removing hazards and messing with momentum." I never quoted you here except for to mock your spelling mistake. What I said is, and this should be clear, is my own opinion and not me putting words in your mouth. I quoted the only bit of your statement that mattered for the point I was making (that banded items on Kitsunoh are bad) and that this option shouldn't be considered except as a gimmick. I don't know how you can construe that as me putting words in your mouth and taking what you said out of context, but in doing so you've failed to show how I took what you said out of context. I quoted you twice; once was to add on my own point about Choice-items and the other was to object to your notion of, as I've concluded, Iron Fist being the optimal offensive-oriented buff.
I read your whole post and agree that it has a niche use with Iron Fist, but that niche misrepresents both the idea behind Kitsunoh as well as its current set of skills. If you're running Iron Fist you're going to want to run at least 2/3 of the accessible moves Kitsunoh has to make the most functionality of Iron Fist. Otherwise, why bother? Plus you're going to want Shadow Strike if it's an offensive set. Plus Kitsunoh is a scout/pivot (scouting in Gen 7 potentially also being a pivot) and thus you'd want U-Turn as well. But what about Defog, which as a utility move you yourself put priority to. So you're looking at something like this:
- Meteor Mash
- Thunder/Ice Punch
- Shadow Strike
- U-Turn/Defog
And what is this, really? Sure, it hits harder in some sort of offensive way, but it doesn't really pivot and if it does, it does it worse now. If you don't run Defog and/or status Colossoil is going to outclass you as a pivot. If you don't run U-Turn, you suddenly aren't a pivot and are working counterproductive to what Kitsunoh's identity actually is. If you don't run 2/3 Iron Fist moves, you're better off running Limber (or Frisk). If you don't run Shadow Strike on an offensive set, that's dumb. What you end up with when you use Iron Fist is move slot syndrome where your ability clashes with your concept and you end up creating this oddly worse Frankenstein. Which is why I straight up asked the question: would you honestly use Iron Fist over Limber (and Frisk)? 9/10, I doubt it. Mega-Metagross does that better, right?
Lastly, yes, Regenerator is generically good. I don't disagree with that statement. What I disagree with is this reverse notion that because something is generically good it's an automatic no. In Kitsunoh's case, it's frail and has average offensive nature. It's quick, but since Generation 5 it's only slightly above average quick (particularly in CAP where a lot of offense-oriented Pokemon have 110+ Speed). Kitsunoh is a well-rounded pivot whose offensive capabilities lay in revenge killing. Not going toe-to-toe and certainly not stallbreaking. When you compare Kitsunoh to other pokemon who have Regenerator you can clearly see a distinction, which I noted. Kitsunoh is the perfect pokemon to receive Regenerator because it buffs it up in such a manner that Regenerator isn't the overwhelming first choice and even when it is in effect, it isn't broken or unfair; because Regenerator matches Kitsunoh's identity like a glove matches a hand. I've laid out facts for why Kitsunoh isn't just any pokemon when it comes to applying Regenerator. If you're going to refuse Regenerator it'd be good, at least since it's on the table, to see some hard proof for why it's not a good idea other than 'it's generically good so let's avoid at all cost'.